David Richard/Richards of Strygosfawr, Lledrod.

[despair]

As far as I know Edward Richard died unmarried and I can't find any evidence that his brother who died relatively young married either.I can't see any reference to sisters-so the only hope of finding a relationship with John and James(even if we confidently knew their parents) would be through Edward's parents,which seems a difficult prospect.
The only snippet I can find,which is slightly mysterious,assuming it is correct,is the following,which refers to a David Thomas "heir at law"(again assuming the correct Edward Richard).

Indenture, being a lease for a year (so that a grant by release might be made) from John Rice of Llandovery, co. Carm., yeoman (eldest son of David Rice of p. Llanavan, co. Card., dec., who was the eldest son of Hugh Rice of p. Lledrod, co. Card., clerk, dec.), Thomas David of p. Llanilar, co. Card., yeoman (eldest son of David Morgan of p. Sputty Ystrad Meirick, co. Card., gent., dec., by Catherine his wife, dec.), David Thomas of p. Sputty Ystrad Meirick, yeoman (heir at law of Edward Richard of same p., gent., dec.), Elizabeth Davies of p. Lledrod, co. Card., widow, and Richard Davies of p. Llanvihangel Lledrod, gent. (brother of William Davies of Penbrynn in same p., gent.) to Rev. David Williams, clerk, curate of Eglwys Newydd, co. Card., of a parcel of land called Gwar-y-fordd-las (8 a.), being part of a tmt called Bryn-merllyd, also parcels of land called Cae-gwyrglawdd-tan-y-fordd-las (8 a.), Cae-penddolwen-cae-issa (12 a.) and one-third part of a piece of bog land (60 a.) called Gorse-glan-teify, being parcels of a tmt called Pen-brin-merllyd, all being in p. Llanvihangel Lledrod, co. Card., but reserving to the said William Davies a right of turbary. Consideration, £200.

The phrase "heir at law" as far as I can tell implies a right through a blood relationship in the case of intestacy.
This is odd because there is a will for Edward in 1777,which makes no mention of David Thomas.The timing of various events is interesting.The will is written in February,Edward dies in March,the will is registered in April,the indentures are dated May and the probate is granted in June.

Perhaps,in my favourite phrase from Rootschat,this is a red herring barking up the wrong tree.
I wonder who David Thomas was?Sounds like he could be a patronymic son of Thomas(Richard?),(therefore ,otherewise,David Richard?)

Regards
Roger

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[Viking666]

  When Edward Richard died he left all of his property to the school at Ystradmeurig. (The mill at Swyddffynnon was left to James Lloyd of Mabws). The Heir at Law has to do all of the conveyancing so that the leases of the properties, and the rents from the properties, are all eventually in the hands of the school. The document you have appears to be a blanket re-negotiation of the leases. The Executors of the Will were his friends, Thomas Hughes, of Hendrefelen, and John Jones, surgeon, of Bryn-hope. The details of the will were drawn-up by James Lloyd of Mabws, a practicing Lawyer and life-long friend of Edward Richard.

 Edward and his brother never married and they are recorded as being the only children of Thomas, innkeeper of the  "Tafarn Ddu" at Ystradmeurig, and Gwenllian his wife. Thomas's Date of death has not yet been established but the following give clues to the circa date. The Inn changed name to The Trout and then to Tafarn y Brithill.

1746, Sept. 28-9
1   Jane Morgan of p. Spytty Ystradmeirick, co. Card., widow
2   Thomas Richard of the village of Ystradmeirick in the said p., yeoman
LEASE AND RELEASE (being a mortgage for £60) of the m. and lands called Bryn Pervedd, lordship of Spytty.

236
1751, Sept. 13
1   James Lloyd of Fôs y Bleidded, co. Card., esq.
2   Gwen Edward, widow and Edward Richard, schoolmaster, of p. Spytty Ystradmeiric
LEASE for the lives of the second party of the m. known by the name or sign of the Trout or Tafarn y Brithill, now in their occupation, village of Ytradmeiric,
 (Gwen Edward could be Edward Richard's Mother).

223
1756, Oct. 28
1   Jane Morgan of p. Sputty Ystraed Meyrick, co. Card., widow
2   Edward Richard of the village of Ystrad Meyrick in the said p. gent., son, heir ands administrator of Thomas Richard, late of the said village, yeoman, dec.

 (Mystery ... who is Jane Morgan ... guess at close relative of Morgan Richards)
 (David Morgan, yeoman ... eldest son of David Morgan, Ystradmeurig)
 We also have the Maurice Richard in tandem with David Richard, (yeoman) in 1683.

  I didn't realize that women used the patronymic form. New search tool for me ... plus the razor.

                                      Regards from Peter.

[despair]

I have found possible death records for Thomas(1772) and Jane(1776) in Westminster(sadly no wills)Could therefore the Thomas who married Lucy Walters of PallMall be a son of Thomas and Jane,and a brother of James and John(if they are of Thomas and Jane of course).I have not been able to trace Thomas and Lucy any further yet.Other parts of the family were here also at this time with Morgan's daughter Rachel,Thomas(senior?)'s sister marrying a Nathaniel Smith in 1767.
There is the possibility that the death records are just a coincidence of names,as they contain no details and there is the 1784 indenture still referring to "..Thomas Richards,late of Lledrod.."

Regards
Roger

[Viking666]

I remember that we visited these two Thomases before, the conclusion being that Thomas Senior was too old to be the parent of John and James and that Thomas Junior was too young. However, your last post set me off again. We have a tentative date of birth of C 1710 for Senior but I can't remember how we came to that conclusion. (Perhaps because he was shown as being a minor and being passed to a guardian on the death of his father, Morgan Richards).
 If born in 1710 he would have fathered James at the age of 53, and that's why he was considered to be too old, but, having looked at the Rev. John Richards, (child at 58) and his son Michael of Parciau, (daughter at 54), and my father Michael, (daughter at 52), then it's quite possible that he could have been the father. When Jane died in 1776, John would have been at Oxford aged 16, James would still have been at Edward's School ... the Thomas Junior would have been their eldest son, and Thomas and Jane joining him and Lucy in London.
I'll have a search to see where Thomas Junior was educated; if at London then that would explain the meeting with Lucy and their presence there at that time.
 There's quite a bit of Razor work going on but it's the only theory that I can put forward.
                            Regards from Peter.

[despair]

I had Thomas (senior) being born later,as in the will of his father Morgan(1749),he appoints guardians for the children,being under 21 presumably.As Benjamin was the eldest,I guessed Thomas being born early 1730s.He would have had to marry by,say,1751/2 to have a son marrying in 1770.It sounds a little tight but just possible.I did also estimate John's birth as 1756/7 from the reported age of 75 at his death.
Perhaps the Thomas of 1770 is from a different family altogether,just a coincidence of names.

Regards
Roger

[Viking666]

The Rev. John was definitely born in 1760 and died in 1832, (aged 72), as per his grave at St. Mary's, Llanerchymedd. He was ordained in 1783.
 If Thomas was born in 1730's then that makes him an even better candidate. His death date of 1772 looks early, but his father died at an early age too. These were the days of epidemics and big cities were not the place to be. Even in Anglesey I see patterns in premature deaths in my own family. John, the 2nd son of the Rev. died at the age of 48 (1849); his wife Catherine died the year after(1850) aged 45. (Their child Elizabeth, aged 15, died in 1845).
The Rev's next child, Ann, Married to Humphrey Jones Evans, Surgeon, lost 3 children ... Robert, D 1840 aged 7; Ann Grace, D 1846 aged 12, Mary, D1845 aged 10. And so it goes on.
 I think that coincidences are never quite as strong as this, and, if Occam's razor is used, well...

                              Regards from Peter

[Viking666]

  I've had another read of that will for Morgan Richards, dated 1749. He was the Vicar of Llandewi Brefi and one of the guardians, Thomas Davies was the Vicar of Llanbadarn Fawr. I also noted that the age of emancipation at that time was 17. Now to find out when Thomas first appeared in Lledrod.
                                  Let's hear it for the Reverends. Hurrah.
                                                          regards from Peter.

[Viking666]

Forgot to say that at the end of the will, when the guardians swear a Bond with the Bishop of Bangor, the eldest child of Morgan is not included, so, during those few days, he must have attained majority.  Peter.

[despair]

I haven't found Jane Morgan's origins,but I'm convinced it is her will of 1763 (LlanbadarnFawr) at NLW.In it she names one of her sons John Rice(her other children are "Rices "also.)He appears,I believe,as John Rice of Llandovery in the 1777 indentures regarding Edward Richard.
As far as I can tell "Jane Morgan,widow"'s first appearance as such in the indentures is 1746.

Regards
Roger