NSW Address but no name

[majm]

I have been reading Jack's AIF file, (38 pages) which includes the AIF transcription of their 1919 marriage, so Nellie HARRIS' father was recorded as William HARRIS, deceased, a Fruit Salesman and John Ingleby LEE's father as John Ingleby LEE, deceased, a Stone Mason.  (the transcriber had initially typed by the occupations with Nellie's dad as a Stone Mason and John's dad as a fruit salesman).

Nellie gives her father as "William HARRIS, deceased, fruit salesman" on the marriage in 1919.  The occupation 'stonemason' was typed in and then crossed out and replaced by 'fruit salesman' in handwriting.

Judith

 

So back in 1919 there was confusion too.   

Red Post .... Agh,  thanks Sue for sorting that.    

Cheers,  JM

[judb]

This has been a great team effort.  Lots of clues, by lots of R'chatters.

Yes, Debra, I did spend an hour or two on a cold Canberra afternoon trawling the electoral rolls.  However it wasn't too hard as Sue had found the MUNROs who were at the same address later which gave the electoral district as "Lang" and the suburb as "Earlwood" so that narrowed it down very considerably and I started with 1937 as I figured they may have been at the same address the year before the letter was written.  Ruskie had winkled out the OP's list of possible forenames.  I can tell you that there are a couple "Eileen May"s in Earlwood in 1937 but on looking for a Nellie there she was at the right address and with a surname. 

Blessings on John/Jack's parents for being so helpful in giving him a second name which is not that common (at least not as a forename).  I doubt we'd have found him if he was just plain John LEE.  The wonderful NAA WW1 digital resource is such a treasure for us - copy of John's record which includes the transcription of the marriage certificate.  There are also copies of hand-written letters in that file from Nellie after John's death.

The spelling Ingulbe on the service record is a bit odd as all of the other records appear to use the other spelling.  The WW1 record, though, is signed by John both in 1914 and in 1917 so.............

This obit (indexed from Ryerson) for Nellie would be worth following up.
Obituary in Wyong Advocate 26 JAN 1983

I may be able to get to the NLA next week but someone else may be able to find it first.

Nellie's address is given as 157 Hume Boulevard, Killarney Vale, via The Entrance.  This area is near the coast, north of Sydney - lots of retirees.  I found the aerial shot of it on Googlemap but the street view that comes up seems to have a different street number. 

Judith

[Vectis2]

Whoa ! you guys have been really busy and my thanks go out to you all for knocking down the wall I have been trying to get over for a long time. You are right Ruskie I was gob-smacked !  well done everyone for you work and taking an interest. 

Right I can see that there are some other questions that have arisen which I will go back and try and answer. Dundee, the Harris, Moore  marriage was my grand mother and Nellie's father, Florence Alexandra  was my mother, The family had moved from Poplar to a small holding at Laindon as a son born before my mother had died of Smallpox on the isolation hospital ship at Dartford [another lose end] Grandfather during the 1911 census was working away at the Royal Alfred seaman's home at Belvedere at that time.

Ruskie and Dundee I am pretty sure that was grandmothers only marriage and with the Harrill and Harris names being so similar it played right into Grandfathers hands, definitely different people [and scandal] as I said before he was a master at blurring lines and a real character with a wicked sense of humour I am trying to work out how to scan the 1894 Fitzroy certificate as it is twice as long as my scanner I might have to do it in two half's  and post it that way. As for what happened to Katerine as I say she did a runner, whether in Australia or returned to UK not sure the trail seems to end, perhaps grandad did catch up with her 

Well I now have to digest what has come to light, such wonderful team work from you all, I am humbled  by your generosity of time and thought a big hug to you all

[judb]

[quote author=Essie link=topic=689883.msg5339752#msg5339752 date=1403011384

An interesting birth in 1894 and I'm wondering if Eleanor was meant to be Eileen?  I believe Nellie has also been a nickname for Eleanor.
Eleanor May HARRIS   
Mar Q 1894
W. Ham  4a /77
Essie
[/quote]

I think this birth would be well worth following up also.  Judith

[Ruskie]

Glad that you have returned Vectis. I am excited that you are excited about the finds! But, it seems you have a few more mysteries to follow up.  I think people were a lot less open then and your grandfather probably just kept things to himself (as any scandals would have been frowned upon). We all have little family secrets lurking in the past.

Henrietta MOORE married William HARRIS in 1893 and had a child named Eileen MAY
Henrietta HARRIS lived with William James HARRILL who was previously married in Australia in 1894.
Eileen used the mother s" defacto" name a little interchangeably with her own birth name of HARRIS
Sue

Sue, thank you. It is all clear now. 

[Ruskie]

Vectis, is it your intention to try to find living relatives in Australia?

(I presume you are elsewhere in the world? UK?)

It is more difficult to trace the living in Australia than it is in the UK (where bmd records go up to the 1990s/2000s).

[Vectis2]

For those interested and by way of giving something back  here is a copy of the Harrill / Simpson marriage certificate of 1894 thanks again all

[sparrett]

Vectis
While the certificate's details are of great interest to us, I must advise that for reasons of copyright R'chat users are not permitted to post large sections or entire copies of these documents.  It is highly likely your post will be removed by a moderator.

However, having said that, I would have been interested in knowing the names of Katerine's parents. Although she says born in Hull UK, it is possible that she came with her parents to Australia and there may be a way to learn more about her.

Can you transcribe the last bit of the document which gives parental information?

Sue 

[majm]

I am not familiar with Victoria’s BDM documents from that era, but I am familiar with NSW BDM documents from that era….

So, I offer the following comments …
When a couple marry, the officiating minister/officer requires the bride and groom and their witnesses to sign several times in various registers and on official documents.  Then the Bride is handed the signed certificate, which has those original signatures.  (Notice that the wife needed the document, afterall she was the one who was about to change her surname) .

The document that Vectis2 holds is not that “Bride’s copy”, but a copy from the Vic BDM (ie from ‘Office of the Government Statist’)  in Melbourne and was issued 25th October 1898.  FOUR years after the marriage...  And, at the top left, there's a Duty Stamp that was franked …. FIVE shillings ... not a penny, but 5/-.     If this were a NSW document from that era I would be thinking “Possibly obtained to support a divorce suit or child maintenance or a warrant for arrest of husband …. Wife desertion ” ….(Not possible to seek to commence a divorce suit/or a maintenance order/etc  without first providing the court with proof of the marriage in the first instance).      This document (25 Oct 1898) was likely sought by someone physically attending and requesting the official document, and if so, likely knowing the date of the marriage and the surnames of either or both the bride and the groom.    (Add, 1898 and NSW BDM registers were not indexed for clerical use within the Register General's Office, I don't know if Vic BDM registers were indexed, but I think the "Pioneer" and "Federation" indexes date from volunteer efforts in the late 1920s and early 1930s.)


Cheers,  JM