Who am I and why did I not exist

[suemillie]

Hi Spades

I did quite a comprehensive search on industrial schools but unfortunately 1918  - 1923 seemed to have a lot of missing information.  I think they were held at National Archives but  I seemed to have come up against brick walls all the time.   1918 of course was the epidemic with many deaths in NZ and I think a lot of information was not accounted for at the time.

Sue

[firefly74]

If his birth was registered under another name, and his birthdate is correct, when the 1918 birth records go online (unfortunately still over four years away..), you might be able to find him by making a list of males born on that date. It would be time consuming, but you could go through the fiche and pull out the male births (starting with the PN region), and then check them on the BDMs online to see if any were born on that date. Even though only the year is listed online, the exact birthdate can be narrowed down using the "to" and "from" fields.

I hope you find him prior to this though

Helen

[suemillie]

Hello Helen

Thank you for this.  Yes I basically did that when I first started. Although without the two and from fields of course.  I ended up with an awful lot of extra birth records and of course too expensive to do that know.  I have to assume that his birth date is correct  as it was the only one he knew and I did search a year before and after.  Interestingly there was three registrations for a birth, I think in 1923 and 25 if I remember (papers in storage at the moment) which I believe related to a 1918 birth.  It seemed they were three failed adoptions.  I was advised by the RGO to apply to the Courts to seek details on the file under a particular section of the Act, which I did, however the Judge decided it was the wrong section and to apply under a different one but the RGO refused to accept that one, so between the two of them arguing the section it came to a stalemate - a further brick wall and  despite my affidavit and reasons given, being exceptional they couldn't be reasonable.

Because He could have been born anywhere in NZ I did extensive searches of other areas also. 

So when the records eventually come online - will they be able to be narrowed down to specific dates?   

Also is it possible for the public to go to the archives and look through the handwritten birth registration records individually and look at all the registrations for a particular date of birth in case the details have not been transferred to the fiche?  I'm assuming not.

Sue

[firefly74]

Hi Sue

The births come online after 100 years, so on his 100th birthday you could start comparing the births on the fiche to the online records. If you enter a surname and restrict the "to" and "from" fields to 10 June 1918, only people born on that date will show up. Alternatively you can determine an unknown birthdate by narrowing the "to" and "from" fields until you hit that date (I also learnt this from a helpful Rootschatter).

It sounds like a very frustrating battle to find out about the 1918 birth. As far as I know, as long as the birthdate was recorded, then you should be able to determine the exact date when the 1918 entries go online. I'm not sure about looking through handwritten records.. I'm sure someone else will jump in and advise

By the way, I have the births fiche up until 1920, so if there is anything you want looked up, feel free to ask.

Helen

[minniehaha]

A very quick trawl through Wellington newspapers on "Papers Past" published between the years 1918 & 1920 revealed these three orphanages:

1.St Joseph's Roman Catholic Orphanage, Upper Hutt.

2.Wellington Presbyterian Orphanage & Social Service Association, the Superintendant of which "can be contacted at Berhampore, Wellington".

3.North Island Methodist Orphanage. I did not follow up as to where this was situated.


Minniehaha.

[Beg Clonrode...]

Yes he had 6 of us  - five sons - do you mean for future use?

Hi again...

I've had no first-hand experience with so-called Genetic Genealogy but from what I've read I'm fairly convinced it's a valid option in a search such as yours. Having said that, there's only a very small chance - but a chance nonetheless - that it will pay dividends in our lifetime.

I can easily see that within two or three generations genetic screening at birth will be a standard procedure, if not mandatory. Two or three generations after that the searching of genetic databases will be as common for our descendants as the searching of the BDM website is for us.

The "serial number" written into a) your father's Y-chromosome, b) his father's Y-chromosome and c) your brother's Y-chromosome is pretty much identical. For the next two hundred-ish years any male born with that "serial number" will most likely be a descendant of your father's father. Or at least share a close common ancestor with your father's father. If this newborn male is not known to your family then he may be the one who breaks the brick wall for your g-g-g-g-genealogist-descendant... and all because you had the foresight to do a Y-DNA test of your brother two hundred years earlier.

Matching Y-Chromosome DNA Results
http://www.smgf.org/pages/yinterpretation.jspx

-----

Unless you can find a sample of your father's DNA then unfortunately DNA testing won't help in locating your father's mother. She did pass on her "serial number" to your father but it stayed with him. A father doesn't pass on his mother's "serial number" to his children.

-----

None of the above will help in your search for a birth certificate but two things I've learnt in my short time genealoging are...

1) B, M and D certificates aren't worth the paper they're written on

and

2) We're all going to end up as a name on a list and I really wish some of those names on some of those lists from a few hundred years ago had left me a DNA sample.

-----

The births come online after 100 years [...]

If it's still necessary and if you remind me and if I'm still around in June 2018 :-) I can do the search of the BDM website suggested by FireFly. Theoretically it should only take 48 hours or so to find everyone born on 10 June 2018.

Regards
Beg

[suemillie]

Hello Beg and Helen

Thank you for this, it is fascinating and is something I have thought about so will follow up on DNA testing, if only for future use.

What I find confusing is that when the BDM do eventually go online and I can search for his birth, if there is no registration there now, why would there be any more information online, or is it because I can view all 10.06.18 births and try and narrowing it down - which I thought could be something that can be done now at RGO or is it because of the 100 year rule now?  searching was so much easier and fruitful before this changed!!

Sue

[Beg Clonrode...]

Hi again...

I don't know about searching the registers in person but I suspect that nowadays the 100 year rule would stop you from doing that. You could always contact BDM NZ and ask.

Personally I can't see the reasoning behind the 100 year rule as the fiche make a mockery of it. Obviously some bureaucrat with an eye to the dollar.

-----

If you want you can search through the 1918 births fiche for all births registered in the Manawatu region. But you don't know for certain that his birth was registered in the Manawatu region so it could be a waste of time.

Whereas you know that his date of birth was 10 June 1918. All births on that day can be found on the BDM website 100 years and one day later, namely 11 June 2018. There is software which will search for births on that specific day. The search normally takes a couple of days to complete.

By my reckoning you'll end up with about 50 names to look at, all of them born on 10 June 1918 (35,000-ish births, half of them male, divided by 365 days)

Of course, if 10 June 1918 is simply a made-up birth date then it's all just gigo :-)

Regards
Beg

[suemillie]

Well after all these years and resuming my search, I have now come to another brick wall, my dad was definitely not registered anywhere official.  Unbelievable that an orphan baby/toddler/teenager can exist in an orphanage, school and sent to a farm and yet no one official had responsibility of him.  I have exhausted all the Archives, Churches and Social Development records and nothing to report.   

Thank you all for your suggestions.  Something’s are just not meant to be found.

Sadly I will now put it to rest!   

Sue