William Rufus Diamond

[MargP]

Hi

I would take another look at the 1851 census, as William is shown has married under the heading Condition

Margp

[avm228]

I would take another look at the 1851 census as William is shown has married

Hi Margp - it looks to me as though he's dittoed as Unmarried from Patrick Callaghan two rows above

[MargP]

I would take another look at the 1851 census as William is shown has married

Hi Margp - it looks to me as though he's dittoed as Unmarried from Patrick Callaghan two rows above

Yes you are right, I have just looked again, it usually states single that's where I mistakenly thought it was married

[londonscorpion]

Hi avm
No, not really as I too had wondered who had filled out that census. I agree with you.
No, for me what has possibly undermined the 1851 census (Sarah with Joseph & Matilda in Brenchley) is the CSEoA: the date of birth discrepancy is just too big: Sep 1824 v Mar 1858, 3 1/2 years. Unless I suppose you argue that WRD really did not know his DoB which is why he asked for the CSEoA in the first place. In 1866 when it was issued he had just married Amy in Gillingham. Their MC says they were of "Full" age.

Hi marge,
I too read that as a ditto on the line above.

[MargP]

Hi avm
No, not really as I too had wondered who had filled out that census. I agree with you.
No, for me what has undermined the 1851 census (Sarah with Joseph & Matilda in Brenchley) is the CSEoA: the date of birth discrepancy is just too big: Sep 1824 v Mar 1858, 3 1/2 years. Unless I suppose you argue that WRD really did not know his DoB which is why he asked for the CSEoA in the first place. In 1866 when it was issued he had just married Amy in Gillingham. Their MC says they were of "Full" age.

Hi marge,
I too read that as a ditto on the line above.

Have you sent for the marriage certificate, for William and Sarah Ann, that may hold some clues

[avm228]

The CSEOA file will have been generated by WRD being required by someone else (some branch of the Civil Service) to prove his age.

It seems to me that Sarah in Brenchley in 1851 must (realistically) be WRD's wife Sarah. In which case Joseph married to Matilda is his father and the overwhelming likelihood is that the 1830 Brenchley baptism as a son of Joseph & Matilda is his baptism.

Which leaves the age discrepancy. Even if the 2 yrs 3 months stated on the baptism was not precisely right I'd think it must be approximately right as it's hard to see how a 4, 5 or 6 yr old could be passed off as a 2 yr old.

As we've said before, that leads to the surprising conclusion that he joined the Army at age 10. We know that he was unusually tall (for the time) so perhaps he was indeed in a position to lie about his age and pretend to be older than he in fact was.

He left the Army in 1864 and the CSEOA is dated 1866 - so when he was back in civilian life some official wanted proof of how old he was. Is there anything in the CSEOA which tells you why it was obtained?

NB: a CSEOA would not have been required for the marriage to Amy. In any event there would not have been any doubt by 1866 that he was of full age (over 21).

[londonscorpion]

Hi Marge
I would if I knew how !!!! I presume there is an equivalent to GRO in Ireland. Please let me know. Is it possible to view an image on line?

Avm
Unfortunately, nothing at all.

[avm228]

I would if I knew how !!!! I presume there is an equivalent to GRO in Ireland. Please let me know. Is it possible to view an image on line?

It looks as though findmypast has a record of the marriage in its Irish records - indexed under William Rufis [sic] Diamond, 1848.  You'd need a World subscription or 5 pay as you go credits to view it.

http://tinyurl.com/na2uhs6 (scroll down to the last result on the page)

Let us know what you find

[londonscorpion]

This is what comes up from FindMyPast
 
    First Name: William Rufis 
    Last Name: Diamond 
    Year: 1848 
    Registered Quarter/Year: 1848 
    Registration District: Parsonstown 
    Volume: 9 
    Page: 547 
    Potential Spouse Names: Sarah Anne Symons
    Mary Fitz
     
    Record set: Irish Marriages 1845-1958 
    Category: Birth, marriage, death & parish records 
    Record collection: Marriages & divorces 
    Collections from: Ireland 

This is the same as the FamilySearch that Marge sent me, but there is no image attached to it. Volume 9 page 547 sound like an index reference. Who do I approach to get a copy of the actual certificate?