Beckley Surname

[CaroleW]

This is getting weirder - I have just posted the following reply - and it's missing.  Here goes again

Re: edits.  Before I edit a post, I check to see if anybody has already posted another reply.  In both cases above - there was no reply after mine so I edited.  Weird

[Annette7]

CaroleW - when I was mid-stream, so to speak, typing out my reply was clearly when you edited.   When I posted no other new post had gone through so no red warning!

No worries.

Annette   

   

[Manchester Rambler]

Re 1871 census - Emma is working in the "Coventry Arms" for a publican named William PHELPS.  I may just have an over-active imagination, but do PHELPS and PHILLIPS sound suspiciously similar?   

Rambler

[Eastbury]

Hi
Like Rambler I wondered about Mr Phelps the landlord of the Coventry Arms, where Emma was living at the time of the 1871 census, but I checked the baptismal record for Andrew at Worcester, St Pauls, his middle name was written as Phillips.
 
Andrew wasn’t baptised until April 22 1872, by then Emma was living in Carden Street. It is probably a coincidence but 15 days after Andrew was born on 6th August 1871, Walter James Phillips was baptised on 21st August at the same church. He was the son of Walter James Phillips (a waterman) and Mary Ann Phillips of Meadow Row.

I couldn’t locate a Bastardy Order, and as Emma and Andrew were in the workhouse on the next census, perhaps she didn’t apply for support from Andrew’s father.

Jack

[kelz29]

Hey, yea at one time i did wonder about Phelps and Phillips sounding similar but i thought it might be abit far fetched, would Mr Phelps of really kept her around living in the same house as his wife!

I know i will probably never be able to find out who Andrews father was so i was hoping to track down Emma Beckley and who her parents were etc.

You say you found Emma Beckley in the Workhouse on the next census (1881) ive only been able to find an Andrew Beckley (right age) in the workhouse but it says he was born in Berkshire and the workhouse is in Oxfordshire

[Eastbury]

Hi
There are well over 100 people in the workhouse and Emma Beckley is on the census page before Andrew. It states that she was born in Tubney Berkshire (as mentioned by CaroleW)

Although the places of births aren’t what you expected I believe it is "your" Emma and Andrew. I suspect that the publican at the Coventry Arms, Worcester told the enumerator that all his staff were born in Worcester because it was less hassle. Looking at the surrounding pages of the census there aren’t any other blocks of residents all born in the same place, so the enumerator seems to have done his best. 

You know that Andrew married in the Birmingham registration district in 899.Did either of the witnesses have the surname New? I ask because on 5 March 1887 Andrew had joined  the 4th Battalion the Oxford Light Infantry.  He gave his address as 4 Caroline Street, Oxford, his place of birth Worcester and his religion as Wesleyan.

The family living at 4 Caroline Street at the time of the 1891 census were Job New aged 26 a general dealer born in Abingdon Berkshire and his wife EMMA stated to be aged 30 born in TUBNEY Berkshire and their young family.

Job and Emma are at the same address up to and including the 1911 census which states that they have been married for 26 years. Job was younger than her and whilst married to Job none of the census returns show that she was born in 1853.

Jack

[Eastbury]

Hi
 
Since posting my last message about Andrew's military record and Emma's marriage to Job New  I've found out a  bit more about Emma. She had married Thomas Smith in the Headington, Oxfordshire registration district in 1882, so when she married Job New in the Oxford registration district 1886 it was as Emma Smith. Her probable death registration indicates that she was 82 when she died in 1934.

Jack

[kelz29]

Wow thank you for all that info, it makes for a very interesting read and because of that bit you wrote about Andrew being in the military i managed to find a piece of information on how he served as an aircraft engineer for the RAF in WW1.

As of yet i haven't got Andrews wedding certificate to My Gt Nan Emma Harper, but i definitely think i will now.

One thing though, i looked at the 1881 census for Emma Beckley and found the one we have been talking about and it lists her as a widower then!!!!

[Eastbury]

Hi
As the RAF record for  Andrew Beckley is for 1918-1928 and hasn’t been digitised it could be expensive to get a copy. Despite the similarity in the two names, the RAF Andrew Philip Beckley was an engineer, which doesn’t fit well with your Andrew Phillips Beckley’s situation in the 1901 or 1911 census. In 1901 Andrew was in the Upton-on-Severn Worcs workhouse, occupation chimney sweep. He was there with his wife Emma and their eldest child Andrew who seems to have died in 1906. We cannot post details from the 1911 census but your Andrew wasn’t an engineer.

As regards Emma calling herself a widow on the 1881 census. It was not uncommon for an unmarried woman with a child to call herself a widow. There was a real stigma attached to being an unmarried mother.

Jack