Author Topic: Gggrrrrrr!! Private Tree on Ancestry photos copied  (Read 91278 times)

Offline Dave Dee

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Re: Gggrrrrrr!! Private Tree on Ancestry photos copied
« Reply #144 on: Monday 03 November 14 17:25 GMT (UK) »
So if I understand correctly, Dave, you would accept something from someone's private tree and then publish it on your own public tree? I know in this case you will argue that it is a public document, but would you also do the same with any other information you were given from a private tree ie photos, family stories? This is the very reason that so many of us keep our trees private. If I share photos I always ask that they are kept private and are not added to a public tree. I hope that the person I am sharing with will have the decency to respect my wishes.

To go back to the point about being ignored - has the person in question responded at all? If not, how do you know that she has seen your requests? She may not be working on her tree at the moment and so is not using Ancestry, she may be ill or have even died. A good friend of mine, the mother on law of a second cousin, has 4 private trees on Ancestry, all highly sourced. However, she sadly died two years ago. As the trees remain there for all to see, anyone asking for details will not get a reply.

Groom, forgive me, but I'm feeling pretty sensitive and annoyed about this, and fancy there's something judgmental going on here about me and my motives. If I'm wrong, then I apologise.

No, I would not publish documents or photos obtained in good faith and confidentially from a private tree, without first obtaining prior permission of the owner, so please let me make that perfectly clear. I do not like any inference that I might do otherwise, or the calling into question of what I might or might not do.

The document referred to here is one that has, until recently, been in the public domain. It is one that I could have obtained myself, had I known Medway Cityark were going to start limiting parish register scans available for public viewing and downloading.

The person in question, a private tree owner, has responded, yes, and you'd need to view my earlier posts to see exactly what happened. To summarise for you, I'd asked politely for a copy of the image concerned (of the parish scan of a marriage ceremony), explaining why I wanted it, and telling her a little of myself. The reply I received was simply, "This lady was my aunt". Later webmailed correspondences yielded similar, short, irrelevant answers. At no point has the woman said why she won't send me the image, and I've found it very frustrating - and very rude of her. I'm not about to crawl. At the very least, she could have said she wasn't willing to provide me with a copy, but she hasn't even done that. She's been active regularly on Ancestry, as reported by that website.

FIN.

Offline Dave Dee

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Re: Gggrrrrrr!! Private Tree on Ancestry photos copied
« Reply #145 on: Monday 03 November 14 17:30 GMT (UK) »
Dave,
She doesn't know what ( if anything) that you intend to do with "her" scan.
That's why she refuses your request.

Anne, if that's what she feels - and, respectfully, that's only supposition - then why the heck can't she tell me so? I'm just asking not to be ignored, as though I'm something sub-human.

Offline youngtug

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Re: Gggrrrrrr!! Private Tree on Ancestry photos copied
« Reply #146 on: Monday 03 November 14 18:29 GMT (UK) »
Just supposition but she may have nicked it from someone else and is feeling defensive, or do not want you to find that out. [You can trace the travel's of photo's/ documents on ancestry back to the original poster]
Apart from that, how people respond to a request is their problem, I wouldn't get paranoid about it.

Offline msr

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Re: Gggrrrrrr!! Private Tree on Ancestry photos copied
« Reply #147 on: Monday 03 November 14 18:53 GMT (UK) »

Anne, if that's what she feels - and, respectfully, that's only supposition - then why the heck can't she tell me so? I'm just asking not to be ignored, as though I'm something sub-human.

Only ignored Dave Dee?  Have you not suffered being blocked yet?

Perhaps as mentioned previously the person you refer to may be unable to respond, for a variety of reasons.

As YT says, the originator of photos or documents up-loaded is mentioned whenever someone copies directly to another tree.   I daresay that some more devious person, to avoid showing that they have copied from another tree, will download it to the computer then upload it to their tree thus being seen as the originator.  But then I must have a suspicious mind, blame it on the spy novels I am in the habit of reading!


Offline Dave Dee

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Re: Gggrrrrrr!! Private Tree on Ancestry photos copied
« Reply #148 on: Monday 03 November 14 20:28 GMT (UK) »
Just supposition but she may have nicked it from someone else and is feeling defensive, or do not want you to find that out. [You can trace the travel's of photo's/ documents on ancestry back to the original poster]
Apart from that, how people respond to a request is their problem, I wouldn't get paranoid about it.

Hi Youngtug,

Under "normal" circumstances, yes, a photo or document can indeed be traced back to the original poster. However, you can then save the same document to your own tree (with the name of the person you obtained it from appended to the document). If you then save that document to your computer, delete the original placed in your own tree, and re-upload it, the document will then be under your own Ancestry name. "msr" correctly points this out in a recent posting - and thanks for that, msr. I've done it myself with a few photos that have been in the wrong orientation, taken from the trees of some fairly close family members - meaning that you have to twist your head to one side to look at a person - or with one that has a huge margin around it that needs cropping - or one that maybe needs a bit more contrast or brightening to enliven the photo - that sort of thing. Some would say that's wrong to do so, but if the end result is an improvement, surely that's OK, isn't it?

Now, turning to your other point, about your implication that I may be becoming "paranoid" about something I feel strongly about, namely the rudeness of a person ignoring me when I make a reasonable request, I put it to you that you could make the same accusation against some of the people in here so vigorously and defensively proclaiming their reasons for making their trees private, could you not? They have their reasons for feeling that way, which I respect, but I also have my own reasons for feeling as upset as I do. It may be, incidentally, as you say, that when a person behaves ignorantly it's "their problem", yes, but when their ignorance is transferred to the recipient in the form of ill-manners, it can then become a new problem for the latter person.

Offline Dave Dee

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Re: Gggrrrrrr!! Private Tree on Ancestry photos copied
« Reply #149 on: Monday 03 November 14 20:33 GMT (UK) »

Anne, if that's what she feels - and, respectfully, that's only supposition - then why the heck can't she tell me so? I'm just asking not to be ignored, as though I'm something sub-human.

Only ignored Dave Dee?  Have you not suffered being blocked yet?


No I haven't, msr, thankfully. That must be worse, but it doesn't take away what I feel about a person behaving in an ill-mannered way by ignoring someone.


Offline jess5athome

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Re: Gggrrrrrr!! Private Tree on Ancestry photos copied
« Reply #151 on: Monday 03 November 14 21:41 GMT (UK) »
 ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D     
Ramsey Ridsdale Ridgway Kempen Knight Harrison Denby Sisson Graney Spilsbury Wain Hebden Abbott Skinn ........ Yorkshire (Doncaster Goole Snaith Thorne area)Lincolnshire Nottinghamshire The Netherlands

Offline andycand

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Re: Gggrrrrrr!! Private Tree on Ancestry photos copied
« Reply #152 on: Monday 03 November 14 23:39 GMT (UK) »
Hi Dave Dee

Parish Registers are copyright of the church, when a person obtains an image from a Parish Register whether by downloading from a website or directly from an Archive there are conditions on the use of that image generally along the lines of being for personal use only but sometimes more specific ie not to be published either on the internet or other forms of publication without permission. Personal Use could also be interpreted as not giving a copy to a 3rd party, certainly that is the case with the likes of DVDs or books. Perhaps the person is reluctant to give you a copy as they don't wish to breach any such conditions.

Generally you will find that websites have cut off dates for original images to ensure they don't breach Data Protection (or similar) Legislation. These websites do err on the side of caution, and some people are not happy about it, but, on the other hand, it can be an expensive exercise if they end up in court for breaching the Legislation.

Andy