R. Kavanagh - Royal Field Artillery

[sirim]

I am trying to find out more about a soldier listed on the Liverpool Hall of Remembrance on-line database. He is listed as : -

Panel 68   PTE.   R.   KAVANAGH       R.F.A. (1ST WEST LANCS.)

I have found a 195608 Gunner Richard Kavanagh in Soldiers Died. Born Portsmouth, enlisted Edinburgh, and on the CWGC site the same soldier is listed as serving with 72nd Bty. 38th Bde.

My question is, are they one in the same person - or is the Hall of Remembrance entry correct and refers to a different soldier.
Any help would be appreciated!

Thanks,

Sirim

[CaroleW]

Hi

This is the cwgc entry for the one you found - not a lot of help though

http://www.cwgc.org/find-war-dead/casualty/1617048/KAVANAGH,%20R

[apwright]

I think the man you are looking for is likely to be 1757 Gnr Richard Kavanagh.
His Medal Card is on Ancestry (specifically stating "Not identical with 195608"), and there are some papers in the Service and Pension records too. These records confirm he served with 1st West Lancs Bde and show he enlisted in Aug. 1914 and was discharged unfit in Sept. 1916 with nephritis.
Comparing his family details from these records with the censuses etc., he would appear to be Richard William Kavanagh, born West Derby Q1 1879, married Frances Hewitt Q3 1900 ... and quite possibly died at West Derby Q4 1916, aged 37 (Kavanagh Richard W, Vol. 8b Page 506). The age fits! Ancestry's Liverpool burial records show that he was buried at Yew Tree Cem on 1/1/17 (grave no. 4B274).

You'd probably need to order the death cert to be certain that this death is the same man, but if the DC positively links the death to the service record, then there might be a case to have him belatedly commemorated by CWGC - as he should be if his death was attributable to his military service. The In From The Cold Project can help with that:
http://www.infromthecold.org/

Adrian

[sirim]

Thank you Adrian for the comprehensive research and quick response. It looks like one of those rare occasions when there are just two possibilities to explore and the relevant records (especially the Service Record for 1757 Gnr R. Kavanagh - Royal Field Artillery) still exists. Even so, I am amazed that you could follow a documented trail right through to his death.
There is also an entry I found in the LNWR Roll of Honour for R.W. Kavanagh a Checker employed at Edge Hill which tallies with the Service Record. I am sure you have identified the right man.

I have also taken up your suggestion to contact the In From the Cold Project to propose that 1757 Gunner Richard Kavanagh is a suitable candidate for further investigation with a view to CWGC commemoration. I will keep you posted on what they advise and how this progresses.

Once again, many thanks for your efforts - especially rewarding as your research may have uncovered information that will eventually lead to official CWGC recognition.

Regards,

Sirim

[sirim]

I am pleased to advise that after a lengthy war graves adjudication process conducted by the National Army Museum, the CWGC have now confirmed that Gunner Richard Kavanagh qualifies for commemoration as a Commonwealth war casualty.

Extract from the Adjudication Form : -

"Although limited in documentation, Gnr. Kavanagh's service record provides key information regarding his disability and discharge from the army. It is evident that the Medical Board reviewing Gnr. Kavanagh's condition agreed that his nephritis was the result of active service and ultimately led to his discharge in September 1916. The same condition claimed his life in December that year. As his death occurred during the First World War qualifying dates and can be strongly linked to his military service, he qualifies for commemoration by the CWGC."

As a final chapter to the positive outcome of this research made possible by the contributors to RootsChat, it would be really great to share this information with any surviving relatives of Gnr. Kavanagh. I wonder if anyone (perhaps around Liverpool)  can assist? Here are the family siblings that appear on the 1911 Census living in West Derby which is a good starting point :-


Frances    Kavanagh    Daughter    -    Female    10    1901    Lanc Liverpool    School    

James Joseph    Kavanagh    Son    -    Male    7    1904    Lanc Liverpool    School    

Margaret    Kavanagh    Daughter    -    Female    5    1906    Lanc Liverpool    School    

Georgina Elsie    Kavanagh    Daughter    -    Female    2    1909    Lanc Liverpool    -    

Richard William    Kavanagh    Son    -    Male    0    1911    Lanc Liverpool    -



Regards,

Sirim

[spotter2015]

This is 196508 on the Menin Gate...( who isn't the man listed on the Liverpool database, the Liverpool man now appears to be 1757 ). How long does it take the CWGC to update a database entry ?!...they haven't yet listed 1757. Not their only outstanding omission, they've even missed a Gallipoli V.C. recipient.

http://www.cwgc.org/find-war-dead/casualty/1617048/KAVANAGH,%20R

http://www.findagrave.com/cgi-bin/fg.cgi?page=gr&GRid=12056343

[ainslie]

Spotter:  CWGC normally adjust their database within a few weeks, but need much longer to amend a stone panel.  That would depend on its condition and the volume of similar work awaiting attention.  That could be months or even years.

Sirim:  Good news that your work has been rewarded.  I suggest you have a look at the Liverpool & SW Lancs Family History Forum.  There are regulars there who might be able to help in tracing relatives of Gunner Kavanagh.

A

[spotter2015]

A database takes seconds to update. There is no stone panel to amend, the soldier on the Menin Gate Memorial isn't the unlisted man in Liverpool.

[IMBER]

A database takes seconds to update. There is no stone panel to amend, the soldier on the Menin Gate Memorial isn't the unlisted man in Liverpool.

OK, so can you think of any reasons why it hasn't been updated yet?

Imber