Hi thanks for your reply it does I think solve a question if Nathan born to William and Mary did indeed die in 1859 I will search for that record I did of course look for it before as soon as I knew there were 2 Nathan's but found nothing so. He is in the 1851 census living with Mary and Mynott and my Great Grandfather William Harvey, his mother is Sarah Harvey a sister of Nathan who I know to be born in 1836 from a newspaper cutting of his father, William's trial. Nathan bn in 1835 and apprentice to Joseph Prime must as you say a different Nathan whose father must be Joseph Harvey as you have mentioned and an unknown mother, As I do know for certain it is not William Harvey bn 1790 Elmdon. Just for interest There are a lot of Harvey's who have done work for various Prime families in my tree. Also there a few Nathan's in the tree so it is likely they are related. Thank you Rachel