Author Topic: Information appreciated for Fox/Shelly & Shelly/Whitty families  (Read 24208 times)

Offline dathai

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 9,078
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Information appreciated for Fox/Shelly & Shelly/Whitty families
« Reply #18 on: Sunday 23 June 13 14:59 BST (UK) »
another one for the pile julia smith dtr of james smith and mary shelly married edmund guinevan in st marys pro cathedral 24 april 1930 some births for guinevan/smith showing up in lismore in the 1930s.

Offline eadaoin

  • RootsChat Aristocrat
  • ******
  • Posts: 1,625
  • Reilg Chill Barróg
    • View Profile
Re: Information appreciated for Fox/Shelly & Shelly/Whitty families
« Reply #19 on: Sunday 23 June 13 23:42 BST (UK) »
strange one. on glasnevin trust genealogy . nicholas fox 1901 age 40 buried in standard grave not on death index.

This man has the following as part of his address ...
6
shaw
villa
great
brunswick
street

maybe this will help to count him in (or out!)

eadaoin
Begg - Dublin, Limerick, Cardiff
Brady - Dublin
Breslin - Wexford, Dublin
Byrne - Wicklow
O'Hara - Wexford, Kingstown
McLoghlin - Roscommon
Lawlor - Meath, Dublin
Lynam - Meath and Renovo, Pennsylvania
Everard - Meath
Fagan - Dublin
Meyler/Myler - Wicklow
Gray - Derry, Waterford
Kavanagh - Limerick

Offline annclare

  • RootsChat Aristocrat
  • ******
  • Posts: 1,434
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Information appreciated for Fox/Shelly & Shelly/Whitty families
« Reply #20 on: Monday 24 June 13 00:25 BST (UK) »
In 1901 Census house no 3 Shaw's Lane Arran Quay there is a Susan Fox age 33 widow living with her parents Michael and Elizabeth Mulvey
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Dublin/Arran_Quay/Shaw_s_Lane/1337547/
the only marriage I found for a Susan Mulvey with parents Michael and Eliza is in 1888 but to a Bernard Lovett in Harrington St church.
Bernard Lovett's mother was Catherine Fox.
http://churchrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/details/b124160004462

annclare
Kerrisk, Healy, McGuire, Duggan - Kerry and US
Tuohy/Toohey,Gorman, Purcell, Fanning- Holycross Tipperary

Offline annclare

  • RootsChat Aristocrat
  • ******
  • Posts: 1,434
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Information appreciated for Fox/Shelly & Shelly/Whitty families
« Reply #21 on: Monday 24 June 13 00:28 BST (UK) »
Just noticed that in the 1911 Census Susan Fox is listed as Susan Lovett Fox widow??? Seemingly no children. http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/reels/nai000103393/
The plot thickens!!
annclare
Kerrisk, Healy, McGuire, Duggan - Kerry and US
Tuohy/Toohey,Gorman, Purcell, Fanning- Holycross Tipperary


Offline dathai

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 9,078
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Information appreciated for Fox/Shelly & Shelly/Whitty families
« Reply #22 on: Monday 24 June 13 15:03 BST (UK) »
i think we have been barking up the wrong tree. i was in g r o this morning and my curiosity got the better of me so i bought the marriage cert for nicholas and mgt 1885 on it his occupation is listed as a porter as is his father william a porter also and thomas shelly deceased a carpenter. i suggest you get one of the certs where michael is the father and compare his occupation if listed differently then you will know if they are truly two different families.

Offline annclare

  • RootsChat Aristocrat
  • ******
  • Posts: 1,434
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Information appreciated for Fox/Shelly & Shelly/Whitty families
« Reply #23 on: Monday 24 June 13 16:39 BST (UK) »
I'm still curious about the Nicholas Fox who is buried in Glasnevin.
annclare
Kerrisk, Healy, McGuire, Duggan - Kerry and US
Tuohy/Toohey,Gorman, Purcell, Fanning- Holycross Tipperary

Offline allesond

  • RootsChat Extra
  • **
  • Posts: 99
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Information appreciated for Fox/Shelly & Shelly/Whitty families
« Reply #24 on: Tuesday 25 June 13 04:15 BST (UK) »
Just home from work, poured an Irish whiskey milkshake and read your wonderful comments. You have no idea how precious your generous interest is in helping our family try again to trace past our grandmother. We grandchildren of Margaret have created all sorts of potential scenarios for Margaret’s children listing “Mother Unknown” on Margaret’s death certificate, such as, being an orphan, living in a workhouse, or even being born illegitimate.  Recently I thought maybe Michael was a brother of Nicholas and assumed fatherhood of Margaret after he died (stretching reality).

My sister applied for a birth certificate from Health Services Ireland and called them after they could find nothing in our parameters of Nicholas Fox as a father and her birth date.  I even thought of just requesting how many Margaret’s were b. on April 19, 1893, but the year is still in flux. The thing is if we don’t use Nicholas as a parameter and don’t know her mother’s name any birth certificate of a Margaret Fox is meaningless, because we won't know if it is her.  This is why I was so intrigued to find the Margaret Mary Fox b. April 19, 1890.

We are fortunate to have been able to trace our grandfather Keith Stewart’s lineage, Margaret’s husband’s, as he is in Burke’s & Debrette’s Peerages as a Galloway descendant. The peerages reported Nicholas Fox as Margaret’s father; unfortunately the peerages did not report the name of Margaret’s mother. 

We had never heard of Nicholas being a Master Mariner until we got their Liverpool marriage license.  As cousins, our collective parents never told us if they had any aunts or uncles.  One cousin had heard of a link to the Boer War, but thought it was a Stewart not a Fox. I could find no Fox listed in the Boer War or find any Fox under Lloyd’s register. Maybe he was just a ferry worker or it was a nice occupation to offer up when marrying a Stewart??

An odd thing I did not mention was on Margaret’s Canadian genealogical death certificate, which includes details of family and medical condition, was an typewriter entry, after the original (in different typeface), a 2nd name of Thelisa. We had never heard this and just thought it an anomaly. I called records and they said they photocopied was there more than half a century ago. I have searched Thelisa, including the name alone, and found nothing to indicate this was her second name. We also do not know if she was Catholic, but just assumed so.

My next steps are:

. Next week when I get my first day off work, Monday, I will order the birth certificate of Margaret Mary Fox April 19. I wonder if this will have Michael’s occupation.
. Look at Glasnevin (which I had never heard before)
. And follow up on 2 Margaret Fox listed on Ancestry b. in 1893 Balrothery; however one is listed as 1st q. and one 4th q.

Thank you, thank you again.
Hugs to all,
Alleson



Offline dathai

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 9,078
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Information appreciated for Fox/Shelly & Shelly/Whitty families
« Reply #25 on: Tuesday 25 June 13 09:01 BST (UK) »
glasnevin trust genealogy also has a burial 1894 grand canal st for a margaret fox age 30 same place alica fox was baptised

Offline allesond

  • RootsChat Extra
  • **
  • Posts: 99
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Information appreciated for Fox/Shelly & Shelly/Whitty families
« Reply #26 on: Thursday 27 June 13 03:52 BST (UK) »
I am so intrigued by the Nicolaus & Margarita Fox parents of Alicia Fox m. to Adam Alexander.

I just looked at the August 1st 1919 Catholic marriage record, on Ancestry.

We know from Alicia's baptism that her father is Nicolaus.
We know from the last column inscription that she married Adam Alexander in 1919.
Alice Fox
Marriage Date: 1 Aug 1919
Parish: St Mary of the Angels
Spouse's Name: Adam Alexander
Father's Name: Michaelis Fox
Mother's Name: Margaritae Fox
Spouse Father's Name: Joannis Alexander
Spouse Mother's Name: Mariae Alexander


Yet, when I read the father's name in the handwritten record, I too looks like Michael, actually, Michaelis. In fact, the transcription reads Michaelis and Margaritae.

Comparing the M's to N's, the m's are different than on Michaelis.

I now believe that Margaret Mary Fox's father could be Nicholas even though Michael is listed as father. Either way, I will check out all leads.

Thank you all!!

Moderator Note : Edit to show extracts of relevant image