Peter Martin, carpenter

[KD146]

I am searching for a Peter Martin, carpenter, from roughly the 1795-1875 period.

Initially I figured he might be from Newry in the North, based on an old family memory of a Newry connection.  But no Peter Martin appears listed as a carpenter in the Slaters Commercial Directory for anywhere in Co. Down or Co. Armagh.

However, a marriage appears for Peter Martin to Mary Levy in 1815 in St. Mary's Pro-Cathedral in Dublin.  This is his wife's name, though it's about ten years earlier than I would have guessed.  No baptism appears for his son Francis, circa 1830-1845 (my gg grandfather), on Irishgenealogy, though of course it might not have been recorded.

Is there a convenient way to search the Dublin directories for a carpenter, or do I have to trawl all the streetnames, one by one?  Any other suggestions how I might verify this Dublin marriage, without their son's baptism?  Many thanks.

[shanew147]

....
Initially I figured he might be from Newry in the North, based on an old family memory of a Newry connection.  But no Peter Martin appears listed as a carpenter in the Slaters Commercial Directory for anywhere in Co. Down or Co. Armagh.
....

I think the logic is a bit flawed there - as a carpenter generally wouldn't be listed in a directory like Slater's or Thom's unless he ran a business e.g. under Carpenter/Builder.

Rather than skipping back a generation I would concentrate the search on the son's baptism - if that can be found it might give you a lead. What were the clues that pointed you toward Newry area?

[murney]

There is a baptism for Francis Martin, son of Peter Martin and Mary Lea%y on the index of www.ancestryireland.com for 1833 - in County Down.  This is a pay per view site but it could well be for Newry parish as they do have those baptisms online and the records start in 1828.   The mother's surname could be mistranscribed - these Newry records can be very hard to read.  You need to put in the % in rather than * as a wildcard for this website.  The name can be spelt as Levy/Leavy/Leavey before name spelling became more standardised in the 20th century.  The baptismal record will give parents' and sponsors' names.  Sometimes an address is given in the early Newry parish records but it is rare.

There are directories for Newry for the 19th century, but I have rarely seen carpenters mentioned in them.

[KD146]

That was quick, thanks!

I do have that 1833 baptism for Francis Martin in Newry, mother's name Leasery.  I did figure that it might be a corruption of Levy/Leavy.  That baptism was what lead me to Newry, coupled with an aunt's recollections of a Newry link in the family.

The earliest confirmed record I have is the marriage of Francis Martin in 1865, with both parent's names given, and Peter's occupation, though Francis had moved to Wicklow at that stage.

I was recommended to check the Slaters Commercial Directories, to look for a Peter Martin, carpenter, as a next step.  Having found none, or as Shane suggests, not the place to find carpenters, I did a general search across a few websites, and Peter Martin married to Mary Levy turned up on Irishgenealogy, in Dublin.

The options are:

Newry, for which there is a family memory and a possible 1833 baptism for son Francis, but no marriage for a Peter Martin to a Mary Levy/Lea%y,

Dublin, for which there is an 1815 marriage for a Peter Martin to a Mary Levy, but slightly earlier than I would have thought, and no baptism for Francis, or

Wicklow, which is looking quite unlikely.

Anyway, I just threw it up here to see if anyone suggests other avenues which might help to verify anything.  Many thanks again.

[murney]

Just a thought!   I know Peter Martin was a carpenter by the time his son got married, but it might be possible that he was a soldier before that (around the time of Francis' birth).  There are a lot of baptisms of soldiers' children in Newry parish (especially in the 1830s) as there was a major barracks there and you usually only see one or two children baptised for the different couples before they move on.  Unfortunately, not all priests listed that the father was a soldier but at least one priest did (mainly in 1836).  It might explain why Peter was in Dublin in 1815 and then in Newry in 1833.  I have seen gaps of 20 - 24 years between the eldest and youngest child in certain families, so 18 years between marriage and Francis' birth, is not too hard to believe.

Just something to keep in mind.

Also, whilst there were Martins living in or near Newry parish, I have never come across the surname Leavy/Levy.  It was usually McLevy, McAleavey, etc.

[KD146]

That's an interesting theory about the barracks in Newry.

I wondered if the Peter Martin married in Dublin in 1815 was the same Peter Martin, father of Francis in Newry in 1833, but I was inclined to doubt it.

Peter Martin married Mary Levy in Dublin in 1815.  There is a Michael Martin baptised in Dublin in 1818, son of Peter Martin and Mary Leavey.  No address.  Then there are a series of children born to a Peter and Mary Martin, no maiden name, in 1821, 1823, 1825, 1827 and 1828, in Bolton Court in Dublin.  Then a gap, and then three more in 1839, 1841 and 1842, but no maiden name OR address.

Nothing to link Michael Martin 1818 to the Bolton Court children, and nothing to link the latter three to the earlier six.  Nothing to link Francis Martin of Newry to any of them.  And nothing to link MY Francis Martin's marriage to any of this, other than mother's maiden name Levy.

However, if the same Peter and Mary Martin with the Dublin children had a child in 1833 in Newry, it would mean they had to move a whole brood of six children north to Newry.  Surely they would not have done that?  Of course, these could all more likely be different people.

Any military records I have found have generally related to WW1 or WW2.  Where would I begin to look for military records for the 1830 period?  Do any exist?  Anything else I am missing?

Many thanks for all your experienced suggestions.

EDIT:  There are a possible two more Newry baptisms to Peter and Mary Martin (no maiden name) in 1831/38 and 1836.  The period 1831-1833-1838 fits perfectly into the gap in the Dublin births, but of course that may well be entirely coincidental.

[KD146]

Many thanks for all your help, Murney.

It looks like the 1815 marriage is the correct one.  Perhaps a marriage will turn up for one or other of the offspring, confirming the parents' names, particularly mother's name Levy.  I will post here if I find one.

[KD146]

I found the following marriage, John Martin to Harriet Oglesby in St. Michan, Dublin in 1864.  John's parents are given as Peter Martin and Mary.

This is the right area, right parents, and 1864 is the first year of marriage registration.  I found the cert in the GRO, and purchased it, hoping it would confirm one of my Peter Martin's possible offspring.

Alas, the marriage cert gave John's father Peter's occupation as gardener.  On my second great grandfather's marriage cert, Peter's occupation is carpenter.

Now, would the same Peter be a gardener and a carpenter on two different certs?  I still have nothing to verify any of my loose ends.  One marriage cert with father Peter Martin, carpenter, or mother's name Levy, would have confirmed it.  I have found no other marriages.