Author Topic: Wicklow DOYLES to Australia  (Read 5244 times)

Offline robgen1

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Re: Wicklow Doyles to Australia
« Reply #18 on: Monday 22 April 13 13:49 BST (UK) »
Hi Cando,

I have been in contact with a couple of Doyle researchers, distant cousins actually i usually check all information regardless of where it came from, myself just to make sure it can be evidenced and validated.

Yep is almost as bad as SMITH

I know there are some very good people on this site hence me asking, have always had some good leads from here in any case.

Thank you and have a nice evening

Cheers
Greg
Roberts - Manningford - Wiltshire - United Kingdom
Gulley - Manningford - Wiltshire - United Kingdom
Simper - Manningford - Wiltshire - United Kingdom
Rutt - Hampshire - United Kingdom

Offline murney

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Re: Wicklow Doyles to Australia
« Reply #19 on: Monday 22 April 13 14:12 BST (UK) »
Hi Greg

I believe I found your Doyles living in Avoca parish, County Wicklow before emigrating to Australia.  If you go to www.rootsireland.ie and choose Wicklow and put in the parents' names James and Margaret, you will find the baptism of Julia in 1838 and Lucy in 1840.  This is a pay per view site so I could only get them on the index.  Also I found a baptism for a Mathew Doyle (parents James and Margaret) in 1822 but not the others (not sure if all baptisms are online on this site).

Dennis Doyle married Mary in 1844, James Doyle married Elenor in 1851 and Mathew Doyle married Elizabeth ONeill in 1846.  Note spelling (i.e. no apostrophes between O and N in O'Neill).  This website doesn't acknowledge apostrophes in spellings.  Also, the spellings of the christian names would be how the priest spelt them.  Elenor (a very common irish name) was spelt Eleanor, Ellenor, Elanor and Ellen.

It could be quite expensive to order these baptisms and marriages but I am going to the National Library in Dublin tonight so I could have a look for you to get the marriage and baptismal records and, therefore, Mary, Elenor and Margaret (James' wife)'s surnames.  I am hoping that Margaret's surname will appear on the baptisms - not every priest gave the maiden name of the mother, unfortunately and I have never researched Avoca parish before, so don't know what you will get!  James and Margaret's marriage is not showing up on the Avoca parish online records but I can have a look for you on the microfilm, if I have time - I only get to spend a few hours in the National Library once a week.

Kind regards

Deirdre


Offline murney

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Re: Wicklow Doyles to Australia
« Reply #20 on: Monday 22 April 13 14:40 BST (UK) »
Had another look and found more children for James and Margaret (that ties in with your list)

1822 Mathew
1826 Margaret
1828 James
1832 Ann
1834 Ellen
1835 Eliza
1838 Julia
1840 Lucy

Can't find Denis or William online but they may have been missing from the records due to clerical error (happened all the time in Ireland, I am afraid!) or just missing from the online records.   I will have a look for them in 1824 and 1830. Hopefully will have some more news for you tomorrow.

Regards

Deirdre

Offline robgen1

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Re: Wicklow DOYLES to Australia
« Reply #21 on: Monday 22 April 13 22:21 BST (UK) »
Hello Deirdre,

thank you so much, for the information. Unfortunately Ireland is a mystery for me thus far doing family research, so i didnt really know what is available so far.

I knew as with all other posts on here i would get excellent leads and help

once again thank you so much, i will be joining the site you mentioned this morning

regards
Greg
Roberts - Manningford - Wiltshire - United Kingdom
Gulley - Manningford - Wiltshire - United Kingdom
Simper - Manningford - Wiltshire - United Kingdom
Rutt - Hampshire - United Kingdom


Offline murney

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Re: Wicklow DOYLES to Australia
« Reply #22 on: Tuesday 23 April 13 10:47 BST (UK) »
Hi Greg

Here is what I found in the Avoca Roman Catholic parish records (on microfilm).

Baptisms :
30 Aug 1826    Margaret, daughter of James Doyle and Margaret McDonnell.  Sponsors : Wm. Mills, Mary Given (?)
15 May 1828   James, son of James and Margaret Doyle.  Sponsors : Wm. Kelly, Mary French
29 Aug 1832   Ann, daughter of James and Margt. Doyle.  Sponsors : Margt. Mills, Bryan Burke
25 Mar 1834   Ellen, daughter of James and Margaret Doyle.  Sponsors : James Larnstead(?), Cathne Clarke
6 Aug 1835   Eliza, daughter of James and Margaret Doyle.  Sponsors : Thomas French, Sally Doyle
5 Jun 1838   Julia, daughter of James and Margaret Doyle.  Sponsors : Anne Kelly
10 Aug 1840   Lucy, daughter of James and Margaret Doyle. Sponsors : Cornelius and Ann Farrell

Marriages :
20 Apr 1844   Denis Doyle to Mary Doyle.  Witnesses : James Conway, Ellen Brown
2 Feb 1846   Mathew Doyle to Elizabeth Neill. Witnesses : John Neill, Eliza Fitzsimmons
2 Feb 1846   John Doran to Catherine Neill.  Witnesses : John Neill, Eliza Fitzsimmons (looks like Elizabeth's sister)
10 Nov 1851   James Doyle to Elenor Kavanagh.  Witnesses : Henry Anderson, Catherine Byrne

Baptisms :
7 Oct 1846   Margaret, daughter of Mathew Doyle and Elizabeth Neil.  Sponsors : James Neil, Margaret Doyle
2 Feb 1849   Mary, daughter of Mathew and Elizabeth Doyle.  Sponsors : Dennis and Ann Doyle
17 Apr 1850   Bridget, daughter of Mathew and Elizabeth Doyle.  Sponsors : William Tierney,    Margret Lennon
25 May 1851   Mathew, son of Mathew and Elizabeth Doyle.  Sponsors : Myles Byrne, Lucy Neill


18 Sep 1845   Thomas, son of Dennis Doyle and Mary Doyle.  Sponsors : Owen Sheridan, Margaret Doyle
17 May 1848   Michael, son of Dennis and Mary Doyle.  Sponsors : Patrick McCann, Elinor Browne

I have put a question mark in brackets of I couldn't read the writing.

Unfortunately there was no sign of Dennis or William's baptism and they are probably just missing from the actual register.  As I said before, this was all too common in Irish records unfortunately.
The priest may have lost the scrap of paper he had written the names on or he just forgot to record the entry.  These registers are covered by two microfilms and I ran out of time before I could look at Mathew's baptismal entry.  I will do that next week, if you like.  I cannot find a marriage for James Doyle and Margaret McDonnell online but I will have a look at the marriage records in the other microfilm as well, just in case those years were not recorded online.  You were extremely fortunate that the priest who recorded Margaret's baptism, actually put down Margaret's maiden name, as you can see, they didn't bother most of the time!

RC parish marriage records do not give names of parents of the bride and groom and unfortunately this parish also did not record the address of the parents with baptised children or the married couple.  The surname Doyle was very common in that parish and there was another James Doyle (married to a Mary) who had children baptised around the same time as James and Margaret, so it may be hard to pinpoint where in Avoca parish, James and Margaret actually lived.

The surname Neill was interchangeable with O'Neill but in those days, the British frowned on 'Irish' surnames and the O and Mc were usually taken off surnames in records, only to be added on in the late 1800s when the Brits relaxed their rules, so lots of Neills, Sullivans, Rourkes, etc., became O'Neill, O'Sullivan and O'Rourke in the records then.  The people would have been known locally by their real name but just recorded in the 'English' way!

I hope this helps.

Regards

Deirdre



Offline robgen1

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Re: Wicklow DOYLES to Australia
« Reply #23 on: Tuesday 23 April 13 10:55 BST (UK) »
Hello Deirdre

Thank you so very much, you have been wonderful for looking up this information.
It is greatly appreciated has made my evening.

I at least have some more to work on

once again thank you very much

Cheers
Greg

Roberts - Manningford - Wiltshire - United Kingdom
Gulley - Manningford - Wiltshire - United Kingdom
Simper - Manningford - Wiltshire - United Kingdom
Rutt - Hampshire - United Kingdom

Offline murney

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Re: Wicklow DOYLES to Australia
« Reply #24 on: Tuesday 23 April 13 11:02 BST (UK) »
Hi Greg

You are very welcome.

I was struck by the fact that there were no McDonnells as sponsors / witnesses as people usually used their siblings, cousins and next door neighbours/friends for those roles.  It is possible that Margaret came from Co. Dublin as you suggested in an earlier posting and as the bride always married in her native parish, then you might have some difficult in finding her marriage.  There were also very few Doyles as sponsors, Sally (Sarah) being the exception, which I also thought strange maybe James was an only child or else some of the women sponsors were married sisters.

I will keep looking and if I can find anything else, I will let you know.

Kind regards

Deirdre

P.S. the Vale of Avoca in Wicklow is a beautiful area - a real tourist spot!

Offline robgen1

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Re: Wicklow DOYLES to Australia
« Reply #25 on: Tuesday 23 April 13 11:12 BST (UK) »
Hello Deirdre

Thank you that would be fantastic, if you see anything else.
From what i know James Doyle  born circa 1976 and his parents are reported as Father: Matthew Doyle and Mother: Agnes

Being so far away from the records just compounds the problems of doing the research.

I was in Ireland some 25 years ago, sadly i never visited County Wicklow so maybe one day i will visit Ireland again and take a look for myself.

So is Vale of Avoca a valley near the sea by any chance? We have in Sydney Australia a beach called Avoca Beach north of the city itself.

Cheers
Greg
Roberts - Manningford - Wiltshire - United Kingdom
Gulley - Manningford - Wiltshire - United Kingdom
Simper - Manningford - Wiltshire - United Kingdom
Rutt - Hampshire - United Kingdom

Offline murney

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Re: Wicklow DOYLES to Australia
« Reply #26 on: Tuesday 23 April 13 11:37 BST (UK) »
If you have looked at the website I sent you then you will see that there is no baptism for a James Doyle to Mathew and Agnes Doyle online, which is unfortunate.  These early parish records can be very patchy and many baptisms are missing. 

The Vale of Avoca is inland but the river Avoca does flow into the sea.  Here are some websites that might help you :
http://grandtour.ie/driving-routes/vale-of-avoca/
http://www.dublindiocese.ie/guidebook/parish/12
http://www.gallda.com/avoca.html

To make it more complicated, the Doyles lived in the Roman Catholic parish of Avoca but the civil parish of Castlemacadam.  However civil records didn't start in Ireland until 1864, so that is too late for you.  Just thought I would let you know, in case you come across the name of Castlemacadam in relation to Avoca.

Regards

Deirdre