Waterford City

[mike13959]

Hopefully someone maybe able to help me out here.

Was what is now known as the "Applemarket" in Waterford City, once part of/or known as John Street.

Thanks in advance

Mike

[nowel]

The Applemarket is still considered part of John's St. However in  1830/1840 it was known as The Car Stand (carriages available to Tramore and Passage). On the 1909 Ordnance Survey map, it is shown as Trinity Square. It was also known as John's Square. It is currently used for small market stalls and a taxi stand.

Noel

[mike13959]

Thanks Noel for your reply, it's much appreciated.

The reason I ask is - I came across a photo recently on the web, it was credited to Jack O'Neill, and depicts an image of an elderly lady, titled 'The Apple Seller,' dated circa 1900. In the backround, I can make out my GreatGrandfathers shop/premises, J D Walsh - 64/65 John Street - Plumber & Gasfitter. Although it says, Broad Street, I'm pretty sure it is John St.

What would confirm it would be, if anyone knows if there was once a clock tower in the square, and if now where is ( I think) a bank, could possibly have been that address, and that the premises had at some time been demolished.

Noel, on an aside, I notice your surname interests include an O'Neill. My own direct family are descendants from O'Neill's, they had business's in Waterford, William, at 33 Michael St, Basket/Bootmaker, and his father Richard, similar occupation, in Spring Garden Alley, any connection?

Regards, Mike

[nowel]

There was a clock tower in the applemarket. Built about 1860 but not sure when it was demolished. Bank of Ireland have a branch there with a rear entrance on to the Applemarket.
If you go to Google maps and find the junction of John St. and Spring Garden Alley and using 'street view' you will see the rear of the bank. The Applemarket is triangular in shape with the apex at the above junction.  Two photos here - http://catalogue.nli.ie/Record/P_WP_0294  and http://catalogue.nli.ie/Record/P_WP_0293
My O'Neills are from the other side of the river in Ferrybank. Don't think there's a connection.

Noel

[mike13959]

Thanks again Noel.

I found the link very interesting, and believe that the premises of J. D. Walsh just about appear in shot on the far right of the photo. (albeit just a tiny proportion of the dwelling)

I took your suggestion about googling the area - Applemarket/John Street, and found premises up for sale - 63 Applemarket, that address being the last of the older buildings still standing before where the rear of the bank is now. If that is the case then I'm pretty certain that would of been where my Ggrandfathers shop/residence once stood -64-65 John Street.

It was also of interest comparing the enumerators additional notes for both the 1901 &1911 returns for the address. We always believed he was at these places on both dates, but the info seems to suggest different - we now feel that he possibly acquired one of those address between the two census's as his business grew.

Thanks again and best regards.
Mike

[nowel]

Mike

You may have come across these already - J.D Walsh of John St. mentioned in both.
www.bureauofmilitaryhistory.ie/reels/bmh/BMH.WS1022.pdf
www.bureauofmilitaryhistory.ie/reels/bmh/BMH.WS1709.pdf



Noel

[mike13959]

Noel thank you so much for pointing these documents out, as I had not seen them before.

We were aware the J.D Walsh was "involved" in those events way back then, but to what extent we weren't exactly sure. From an obituary it did say he was interned at Ballybricken and later at Kilworth, and that he played a prominent part in the Volunteer Movement prior to his connection with Sinn Fein, of which I understand he was president of the Thomas Meagher Club in Waterford.

Some of those names in both documents are familiar; from documents recently received from the Irish Government in regards of applications for a pension for my grandmother. (J.D's daughter)
I will go through them later and try see where it all fits in.

The statement of Sean Matthews has really got my attention, and I really need to go through it thouroughly. He mentions the name; Michael O'Neill of Michael Street several times, he was my grandfather, and again, we did know some of his involvement, but this seems to suggest he was quiet high up in the organisation.
It also seems to touch on a story which could be the one we were told, that both he and J.D. Walsh were almost killed when they were been transported (as prisoners) from Ballybricken gaol to somewhere in Cork, and were ambushed by others who were unaware there were prisoners in the convey.

Fascination reading, and many thanks again Noel.

Regards, Mike