1851/1861/71/81 census look up please - Yorkstone

[Forfarian]

The 1861 Census info was from a transcription, so it's anybody's guess (I guess!!)

Now that I am home (I was in France all last week) I have been able to look at my research files. I do have my own transcription of that 1861 census, as it happens, listing Ann Yorkeston, married, 42, born Dunipace, with sons John, 16, and Peter, 14, at North Road, Stenhousemuir.

I cannot find her husband anywhere in Scotland, England or Wales in 1861 or 1871, though I am obviously relying on someone's indexing which could easily be wrong. Nor can I find his death anywhere in Scotland.

[vinci]

Forfarian has, in answer to my Q.

There is a Peter Low, son of James Low and Marion Yorkston, born 1840 in Larbert and baptised on 23 August 1840. The 1851 census lists in Stenhousemuir a family consisting of James Lowe, 34; wife Marion, 32; and son Peter, 10; all born in Larbert.

At 1841 here they are:

1841 Census
3 Records found
        
Piece: SCT1841/485 Place: Larbert -Stirlingshire Enumeration District: 2
Civil Parish: Larbert Ecclesiastical Parish, Village or Island: Larbert
Folio: 485 Page: 6
Address: Rennies Feus

        Surname       First name(s)       Sex       Age       Occupation       Where Born       Remarks   
        LOW       James       M       20       Turner        Stirlingshire           
        LOW       Marion       F       20               Stirlingshire           
        LOW       Peter       M       1               Stirlingshire

and the birth of Peter:

Birth Peter Low 4.8.1840 Larbert Mother Marion Yorkston father James Low

This Marion Yorkston cannot be the Marion daughter of John Yorkston and Janet Kerr, as she is born c 1821, whereas Marion daughter of John+Janet is born 20.1.1781, a good generation away.

So far I have been unable to find a birth of a Marion Yorkston c. 1821, and which may help to unlock the puzzle a little further.

Vinci

[Forfarian]

This Marion Yorkston cannot be the Marion daughter of John Yorkston and Janet Kerr, as she is born c 1821, whereas Marion daughter of John+Janet is born 20.1.1781, a good generation away.

I thought she must be a daughter of Alexander Y and Ann Kincaid and therefore the granddaughter of John Y and Janet Kerr. As she was aged 32 in 1851, she would have been born 1818/19.

[vinci]

Forfarian.......

There is no record of a Marion Yorkston born to Alexander Yorkston and Ann Kincaid.

Your thought needs some proof that you are right.

I have not been able to find this Marion's death record to confirm your thought.

all we have on the record are two sons:

(1)Alexander b/c/ 23.5.1814 Larbert ( d. 25.6.1850 St. Cuthbert's Edinburgh)

(2) John b/c/ 1811 Larbet

and on John we have no further data, he disappears off the radar .....not on 1841 census or 1880 US census or Scottish/Engflish/Canadian 1881 census.

John Yorkston and Janet Kerr have six children
Alexander, Marion, Agnes, Archibald, Alexander and Janet.

In this era it is a possibility that emigration took place and the Low family went abroad (Yorkstons from the Alexander Yorkston + Catherine Phair branch later went to the US) , so the hunt continues.

vinci

[lgardner2000]

Hello,
What confusion I have caused!!!
Have just quickly signed on to check emails and have seen your discussions you have been having about the Yorkston/e family.
I am currently on my way out, but when I return I will look at my research to see what I have got to see if we can work it all out.

Thanks
Lisa

[Forfarian]

There is no record of a Marion Yorkston born to Alexander Yorkston and Ann Kincaid.
Your thought needs some proof that you are right.
I have not been able to find this Marion's death record to confirm your thought.

You are absolutely right, and I have not found a death certificate either. However the fact that Peter Lowe was the grandson of Alexander Y d 1857 is a useful pointer.

The Yorkstons generally seem not to have been very diligent at having their baptisms recorded. For example, the records list only two sons of John Y and Elizabeth Esplin, but there are death certificates for a son (Malcolm) and a daughter (Janet, wife of George McRae) and the 1851 census lists a daughter Margaret as well as son William. The 1841 lists an Archibald and a George who may also be sons. (I do not know who the father of this John Y was, but he had died before 1841.)

In fact there are so many missing Yorkstons that I have been tempted to wonder if there is some common spelling variant I haven't thought of 

[vinci]

Forfarian.......

Your reference to:

The Yorkstons generally seem not to have been very diligent at having their baptisms recorded

Is perfectly correct and reminds me of the note that I have for the children of Alexander Yorkston and Catherine Phair which says:

...." entry of births for all children dated 29th December 1854
it refers to Alexander Yorkston ( now deceased ) and Catherine Phair "

......one wonders why the entry was made 4 yrs after Alexander's death?

Seeing the names John Y and Elizabeth Esplin reminds me also that Archibald Yorkston 1790-1870, son of John Yorkston and Janet Kerr, marries Marion Esplin 13.11.1814 at Larbert. ( Marion looks to be the sister to Elizabeth)

Marion's parents are John Esplen[e] + Marion Gilchrist, for whom IGI has the following:

1. WILLIAM ESPLINE  - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Male Birth: 04 FEB 1783 Wallacetown-Polmont, Dunfermline, Fife, Scotland
2. William <ESPLIN> - International Genealogical Index
Gender: <Male> Birth: 04 FEB 1783 Wallacetown, Polmont, Stirling, Scotland
3. Elizabeth <ESPLIN> - International Genealogical Index
Gender: <Female> Birth: 18 APR 1793 Wallacetown, Polmont, Stirling, Scotland
4. WILLIAM ESPLINE - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Male Christening: 10 FEB 1783 Polmont, Stirling, Scotland
5. MARION ESPLIN - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Female Christening: 02 MAY 1790 Polmont, Stirling, Scotland
6. ELISABETH ESPLINE - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Female Birth: 18 APR 1793 Wallacestone And Standrig, Stirling, Scotland
7. MARION ESPLINE - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Female Birth: 29 APR 1790 Wallacestone And Standrig, Stirling, Scotland
8. Marion <ESPLIN> - International Genealogical Index
Gender: <Female> Birth: 29 APR 1790 Wallacetown, Polmont, Stirling, Scotland
9. ELIZABETH ESPLIN - International Genealogical Index
Gender: Female Christening: 28 APR 1793 Polmont, Stirling, Scotland 

Who is the John Yorkston who married Elizabeth Esplin? Who were his parents? and where does he fit into the jigsaw?

Vinci

[Forfarian]

......one wonders why the entry was made 4 yrs after Alexander's death?

There was an officially sanctioned rush in 1854 to get hitherto missing baptisms listed in the parish registers before the start of civil registration in 1855. Many parish registers contain a separate 'Register of Neglected Entries' but others just list them among the normal records for 1854.

Who is the John Yorkston who married Elizabeth Esplin? Who were his parents? and where does he fit into the jigsaw?

As I said above, I do not know.

He could possibly be the son of John Yorkston and Janet Cow, baptised in Falkirk on 19 May 1783. But if so, why did he not have a son named John? Or maybe he did, and he doesn't appear in any of the records.

Or maybe he was an unrecorded son of John Y and Janet Kerr? There are some gaps among their children.

I suspect we are unlikely ever to find the answer to that question!

[Forfarian]

The proof that there were two Alexander Yorkston(e) of similar age is in the 1841 census

1841 Census: Greenside Row, Edinburgh, Midlothian 685/4/2
Alexander Yorkston           27 Smith Journeyman               Scotland not Midlothian
Catherine Yorkston            25                                           Midlothian
John Yorkston                     4                                           Midlothian
James Yorkston                 18 months                                 Midlothian

1841 Census: Larbert Village, Larbert, Stirlingshire 485/1/2
Margt Nicol               34                        Stirlingshire
Alx Yorkston              25  Mason          Stirlingshire
Ann Yorkston             20                        Stirlingshire
Janet Yorkston          1                          Stirlingshire

We have one living in Edinburgh and giving his age as 27, which, if accurate, means that he was born in 1813 or 1814. The one in Larbert gives his age as 25, but since ages in 1841 were supposed to be rounded down to the nearest 5 years, he would have been born between 1811 and 1816.

Ten years later

1851 Census: Allison Place, Edinburgh St Cuthbert's, Midlothian 385/1/36
Catherine Yorkston       Head Wid 42  Pauper              Midlothian, Edinburgh
Alexr Yorkston             Son 16  Engineer apprentice    Midlothian, Edinburgh
John Yorkston               Son 14 Message boy               Midlothian, St Cuthbert's
James Yorkston             Son 12  Scholar                     Midlothian, Edinburgh
Cathrine Yorkston          Daughter 8  Scholar              Midlothian, Edinburgh
Archibald Yorkston        Son 6  Scholar                      Midlothian, Edinburgh
May Ann Yorkston          Daughter 4                           Midlothian, Edinburgh 
William Yorkston           Son 2                                    Midlothian, St Cuthbert's

This ties in with the 1850 death in Edinburgh.

1851 Census: South Broomage Hall, Larbert, Stirlingshire 485/8/9
Alexander Yorkston     Head Mar 36  Farmer employing 3 labourers      Stirlingshire, Larbert
Ann Yorkston               Wife Mar 32                                                 Stirlingshire, Larbert
Janet Yorkston             Daughter 11  Scholar                                    Stirlingshire, Larbert
Alexander Yorkston     Son 9  Scholar                                              Stirlingshire, Larbert
John Yorkston              Son 6  Scholar                                             Stirlingshire, Larbert
Peter Yorkston             Son 4  Scholar                                             Stirlingshire, Larbert
Ann Yorkston                Daughter 2                                                 Stirlingshire, Larbert
3 servants

This shows that the husband of Ann Kincaid was born in Larbert in 1814 or 1815.

So there were definitely two Alexander Yorkston(e)s born about 1814, one married to Ann Donaldson and one married to Catherine Phair/Fair.

The husband of Catherine Phair in Edinburgh is variously described as engineer, mechanical engineer and practical engineer.

The husband of Ann Donaldson is variously described as a mason, bricklayer and also a farmer.

The children of Catherine Phair/Fair were Alexander, John, James, Catherine, Archibald, Mary Ann, William and James, Catherine's parents were John and Mary. If they had followed the naming tradition their first daughter would have been named Mary, so no inferences can be drawn from her children's names.

The children of Ann Donaldson were Janet, Alexander, John, Peter and Ann. Ann Donaldson's parents were John Donaldson and Janet Malcolm. She named her first daughter Janet and her second son John, which is in accordance with the naming tradition. The names of her first son and second daughter are consistent with her husband's parents being Alexander and Ann.

So there definitely were two Alexander Yorkston(e)s of the same age

One born in Larbert about 1814, married in Larbert in 1839 and with children's names that would fit with his parents being Alexander Yorkston and Ann Kincaid.

The other born about 1814 somewhere in Scotland, married to Catherine Phair/Fair in Edinburgh in 1833, with children's names that cannot be matched to the naming tradition.

So it is still not possible to say with certainty which Alexander Yorkston was which, unless someone else has a piece of evidence to prove the identity of one of them one way or the other.

I don't really care very much what the correct answer is, but I do very much care about it actually being right!