Author Topic: Edward Sheehy Pallaskenry town of Pallas Chapelrussel, Co. Limerick  (Read 6607 times)

Offline Mary-Agnes

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Edward Sheehy Pallaskenry town of Pallas Chapelrussel, Co. Limerick
« on: Wednesday 20 February 13 15:16 GMT (UK) »
My Great Grandfather Edward Sheehy was born about 1845 in Limerick Ireland the son of Edward Sheehy, labourer.  I recently found Edward’s service records and he enlisted in the British Army 19th August 1870 Aldershot.  At the time of his enlistment he was described as a 25 year old groom who was born in the Town of Limerick, Parish of Limerick, County of Limerick, Ireland and his religion was Church of Ireland/England! 
According to his 1911 census return, Edward stated that his place of birth was Palace Kenry, Limerick.  This is most likely the village of Pallaskenry, a village in the town land of Pallas in the civil parish of Chapelrussel, Co. Limerick. The village is located close to the Shannon estuary outside of the City of Limerick.
Unfortunately, after an extensive search of both the Roman Catholic and Parochial baptisms records could not locate a Baptismal Record for Edward Sheehy born to a father Edward Sheehy
There are several possibilities why the baptism of Edward Sheehy could not be found, i.e. the transcript that was consulted did not include all events that took place in the parish and excluded the Sheehy family.  If Edward was not baptised in the parish of Chapelrussell, it is possible that he was baptised in a neighbouring parish.  The small parish of Chapelrussell is surrounded by the parishes of Ardcanny, Kilcornan and Kildimo.  Of course it is possible that he was born and baptised elsewhere and only settled in Pallaskenry as a young child.
Can anyone help and/or know of an Edward Sheehy born about 1845 whose father was also named Edward, born in/around Pallaskenry in the village in the town land of Pallas in the civil parish of Chapelrussel, Co. Limerick
Additional info: Edward married Lydia Lewis on 4th September 1882 in Cardiff Glamorgan Wales and they couple had 5 children; David J (b. 1878) Edward (b. 1890), Gladys (b. 1896), William Herbert (my grandfather b. ca. 1898) and Gwendoline (b. ca. 1910). Edward Sheehy died in Cardiff Wales in 1923.

Thank You Mary-Agnes  :) :) :)

Offline aghadowey

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Re: Edward Sheehy Pallaskenry town of Pallas Chapelrussel, Co. Limerick
« Reply #1 on: Wednesday 20 February 13 16:24 GMT (UK) »
Welcome to Rootschat. Could you clarify this bit, please? "... an extensive search of both the Roman Catholic and Parochial baptisms records could not locate a Baptismal Record..."
Do you mean that both actual Catholic and Church of Ireland records were checked and no records found, you've checked both online and not found, or      ?

Added- very few Co. Limerick C. of I. records listed in RCB, Dublin catalogue-
http://ireland.anglican.org/cmsfiles/pdf/AboutUs/library/parregs.pdf
Nothing coming up in LDS catalogue either-
https://www.familysearch.org/catalog-search
Away sorting out DNA matches... I may be gone for some time many years!

Offline Mary-Agnes

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Re: Edward Sheehy Pallaskenry town of Pallas Chapelrussel, Co. Limerick
« Reply #2 on: Wednesday 20 February 13 18:30 GMT (UK) »
Aghadowey thank you for taking the time to reply - yes both Catholic and Church of Ireland in Chapelrussell were checked,  May be it would help if I explain a little further - I could not find any records on line relating to Edward Sheehy before he enlisted in Aldershot 1870.

Therefore I contacted Genealogists Research Company in Dublin to assist!  Their first search was undertaken with the information provided and finally Edward’s 1911 census return where he stated that his place of birth was Palace Kenery, Limerick, this most likely being the village of Pallaskenry, Town-Land of Pallas in the civil parish of Chapelrussel, Co. Limerick!
Also a Griffith's Valuation recorded an Edward Sheehy residing in the town land of Pallas civil parish of Chapelrussel where he leased a house and was believed by the research company “was most likely the father of Edward Sheehy”.  The valuation was made in December 1850.

From my understanding the civil parish of Chapelrussell was/is very small and corresponded with the Roman Catholic parish of Kildimo.  The records for Kildimo date from 1831 for baptisms and although there was a gap in the baptismal register from November 1845 to January 1846 I agreed to an examination of the parochial records for the RC Parish of Kildimo for the baptism of Edward, the son of Edward Sheehy, the Baptismal Records for Edward Sheehy's siblings and the Church Marriage Record for his parents.

Unfortunately, the research was not successful and the examination of the parochial records for the RC Parish of Kildimo did not locate the Baptismal Record for Edward Sheehy or any other children issuing from a father named Edward Sheehy!

I agreed a second search for parochial records for the Church of Ireland Parish of Chapelrussell, which I was informed were only available in the form of transcripts that the original records for the parish were destroyed in 1922 (source: NAI., M.5972-6).  A search was made of the Chapelrussell Baptismal Register transcripts from the beginning of 1820 until the end of 1860; the Marriage Register from the beginning of 1820 until the end of 1860 and the Burial Register from the beginning of 1845 until the end of 1870.  During the periods of this search it was noted no references to any events for the family name Sheehy.
 
However, I was advised by said research company there are several possibilities for why they could not find the baptism of Edward Sheehy.  It is possible that the transcript they consulted did not include all events that took place in the parish and excluded the Sheehy family?
They went onto inform me “if Edward Sheehy was not baptised in the parish of Chapelrussell, it is possible that he was baptised in a neighbouring parish”.  The small parish of Chapelrussell is surrounded by the parishes of Ardcanny, Kilcornan and (Kildimo).

The church of Ireland registers survive for Ardcanny and Kildimo and the said company suggested further searches could be made for evidence of the baptism of an Edward Sheehy born abt 1845.  But I feel this may not be an avenue to take because they have already stated they researched the parishes of Kildimo?

Of course it is possible that he was born and baptised elsewhere and only settled in Pallaskenry as a young child.  There is no guarantee that further research of the local parish registers will identify a baptismal record for Edward.  Therefore I decided to blog a few sites to see if anyone could help me!

It was Edward’s services records that stated he was Church of England/Ireland and not Catholic as first assumed in the initial search! 

I have to say I have completed my dads of the family history back to early 1700 including all off shoots of the family, but my mum’s side is proving somewhat problematic,

Unfortunately, as I am sure you have already worked out the second research was also unsuccessful.

Hope this makes the situation much clearer.
Kind Regards
Mary-Agnes

Offline morenae

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Re: Edward Sheehy Pallaskenry town of Pallas Chapelrussel, Co. Limerick
« Reply #3 on: Thursday 28 February 13 17:08 GMT (UK) »
kilcornan & stonehall,
church of ireland,
2 miles from pallaskenry,
try that parish.

look for the records on, 
roots ireland,
irish family histry foundation.

regards john.


Offline Mary-Agnes

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Re: Edward Sheehy Pallaskenry town of Pallas Chapelrussel, Co. Limerick
« Reply #4 on: Sunday 10 March 13 18:28 GMT (UK) »
kilcornan & stonehall,
church of ireland,
2 miles from pallaskenry,
try that parish.

look for the records on, 
roots ireland,
irish family histry foundation.

regards john.

Hi john thank you for you assistance I re posted the research I have done since your message
I could find in the Parish/District KILCORNAN & STONEHALL County Co. Limerick, was born 20-Sep-1848 Baptism 1-Jan-0 - Father Myles Sheehy Mother Margaret Downes Sponsor/Informant 1Michael Downes Sponsor/Informant 2 Jna. Fitzgerald.  I don’t feel this is my great grandfather.
Regards Mary-Agnes  :)

Offline Mary-Agnes

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Edward Sheehy born in Pallaskenry, Chapelrussel, Co. Limerick abt: 1845!
« Reply #5 on: Wednesday 29 January 14 12:21 GMT (UK) »
Hi everyone firstly thanks for all your assistance to date re: Edward Sheehy born in Pallaskenry, Chapelrussel, Co. Limerick abt: 1845!  I haven’t given up trying to locate my great grandfather Edward Sheehy’s parents/family and where he was born in Limerick.

However, since my initial posting I have managed to obtain Great-Grandfather Edward Sheehy’ death certificate and a copy of the Wales 1911 Census!

From both the above documents and information from Edward’s only surviving Granddaughter it appears Edward on joining the army in Aldershot had most likely given incorrect details regarding his place of birth, age and religion!

In the Wales 1911 Census, Edward appears to be making up for any error on his service records by being very specific about his age (73 years) therefore, putting his birth abt: 1838 not 1845 as initially thought!

Edward also detailed his location of birth as ‘Palace Kenery’ Limerick, which has been identified as, the town of Pallaskenry where his religion would almost certainly have been ‘Roman Catholic’ and not ‘Church of England’ as stated on his service records!

Edward’s 79 year old surviving Granddaughter has maintained that Edward was a lot older than his death certificate states and believes Edward’s was approximately 85/6 years old when he died in 1923, and not 73 years as stated on his death certificate!  If Edward was 85/6 years old as his granddaughter insist this again puts Edward’s birth 1838!

In summary - If the information Edward has given in the Wales 1911 census are correct and I strongly believe they are - he was ‘Roman Catholic’ – His aged when he enlisted in 1870 was in fact 32 and not 25 years old which again puts Edward’s birth year 1838!
Re-examining other documents - It appears there are possible related baptisms records for Edward, but none of the records include an exact location.

Three possibly baptisms were found near to Edward’s birth year:
4th January 1832   John Sheehy – Parents: Edmund Sheehy and Maria Dalton.  Sponsors: Patrick O’Dea and Eliza Sheahan.  No address recorded.
4 January 1832   John Sheehy to Edmund and Maria Dalton. Sponsor: Patrick O’Dea and Eliza Sheahan. No address recorded.
February 11th 1838 Edmundum Sheehy – Parents: Edd. Sheehy & Maria Dalton.  Sponsors: James Nash and Eliz Naughten.  No address recorded!

I believe the latter baptism entry could possibly be my G/Grandfather Edward.  However, no Will for Edward or Maria that might have listed children a marriage, or possible death, mainly I think ‘too many with the same name in the relevant District to choose from’!

A record in The Griffith’s Valuation hit an Edward Sheehy leasing a house in December 1850 in the townland of Pallas, civil parish Chapelrussel!  I think this could possibly be my Edward’s father!
Also the Griffiths Records relating to the Parish of Chapelrussel not only finds an Edward, but also Bryan, John and Patrick living in the town but, by the time of the first Revision in 1855 only Bryan remains!

The following entries in the 1851-2 civil parishes of Chapelrussel and Kilronan:
Pallas (Chapelrussel)      Map Ref.   A   R   P    Description      
Edward Sheehy         44/82      0   0   0   12 shilling House
Bryan            34/21      0   0   0   12 shilling House & Yard
John                    38/65      0   0   0   12 shilling House
Patrick            47/31      0   0   0   12 shilling House

From my understanding as part of the introduction of fair rateable values for properties, regular updates were made and these were kept in Revision Books which for this parish commenced in 1857 where only one Sheehy was found, a Bryan Sheehy - Ref No: 22.  The numbering of plots and ownership changed considerably and without detailed surviving maps, it was difficult to determine.

The maps shown on askaboutireland are almost certainly later than the survey of 1851-2.  However, an alternative, undated map, which also appears to be older than the Griffith’s survey does record some of the number changes and where St. Mary’s Church is located, plot 82!

It appears plot 82 is where Edward Sheehy (1850) was living about the time of Griffiths, but as the church was built in 1863, it is most probable he has moved elsewhere. This might explain why Edward cannot be found on later property records; he had moved elsewhere?

Searching of Griffith’s Revision Books at the Valuation Office in Dublin of the Griffiths Revision Books Pallaskenry DED, 1855 –2002, Parish of Chapelrussel also found the following changes to occupancy of these properties and curiously, the following year the adjoining property is occupied by an Edmond Dalton, (baptism of Edward Sheehy February 11th 1838 mother Maria Dalton) the only Dalton name seen in the parish of Chapelrussel!  In 1892 Bryan Sheehy also occupies this House. 

In 1903 both properties transfer to a Michael O’Shaughnessy.
Pallaskenry Town      Map Ref.         Description
Bryan Sheehy              23/12              to Michael Knowles   1863
Bryan Sheehy              23/22             from John Murphy   1863   10 shilling House
John Lynch                      23/23         to Edmund Dalton   1864
To Bryan Sheehy   1892
To Michael Shaughnessy1903


Offline aghadowey

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Re: Edward Sheehy born in Pallaskenry, Chapelrussel, Co. Limerick abt: 1845!
« Reply #6 on: Wednesday 29 January 14 12:27 GMT (UK) »
You've posted in Ireland Resources (which is not for queries) rather than Limerick board- click on 'report to moderator' to fix this.

Earlier topic -
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=639125


Best to keep everything on one thread to avoid needless duplication and confusion.

New topic merged with one of the old topics
Away sorting out DNA matches... I may be gone for some time many years!

Offline Mary-Agnes

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Re: UPDATE Edward Sheehy Pallaskenry town of Pallas Chapelrussel, Co. Limerick
« Reply #7 on: Wednesday 29 January 14 14:40 GMT (UK) »
Hi everyone firstly thanks for all your assistance to date re: Edward Sheehy born in Pallaskenry, Chapelrussel, Co. Limerick abt: 1845!  I haven’t given up trying to locate my great grandfather Edward Sheehy’s parents/family and where he was born in Limerick.
However, since my initial posting I have managed to obtain Great-Grandfather Edward Sheehy’ death certificate and a copy of the Wales 1911 Census!
From both the above documents and information from Edward’s only surviving Granddaughter it appears Edward on joining the army in Aldershot had most likely given incorrect details regarding his place of birth, age and religion!
In the Wales 1911 Census, Edward appears to be making up for any error on his service records by being very specific about his age (73 years) therefore, putting his birth abt: 1838 not 1845 as initially thought!
Edward also detailed his location of birth as ‘Palace Kenery’ Limerick, which has been identified as, the town of Pallaskenry where his religion would almost certainly have been ‘Roman Catholic’ and not ‘Church of England’ as stated on his service records!
Edward’s 79 year old surviving Granddaughter has maintained that Edward was a lot older than his death certificate states and believes Edward’s was approximately 85/6 years old when he died in 1923, and not 73 years as stated on his death certificate!  If Edward was 85/6 years old as his granddaughter insist this again puts Edward’s birth 1838!
In summary - If the information Edward has given in the Wales 1911 census are correct and I strongly believe they are - he was ‘Roman Catholic’ – His aged when he enlisted in 1870 was in fact 32 and not 25 years old which again puts Edward’s birth year 1838!

Re-examining other documents - It appears there are possible related baptisms records for Edward, but none of the records include an exact location.
Three possibly baptisms were found near to Edward’s birth year:
4th January 1832   John Sheehy – Parents: Edmund Sheehy and Maria Dalton.  Sponsors: Patrick O’Dea and Eliza Sheahan.  No address recorded.
4 January 1832   John Sheehy to Edmund and Maria Dalton. Sponsor: Patrick O’Dea and Eliza Sheahan. No address recorded.
February 11th 1838 Edmundum Sheehy – Parents: Edd. Sheehy & Maria Dalton.  Sponsors: James Nash and Eliz Naughten.  No address recorded!

I believe the latter baptism entry could possibly be my G/Grandfather Edward.
A record in The Griffith’s Valuation hit an Edward Sheehy leasing a house in December 1850 in the townland of Pallas, civil parish Chapelrussel!  I think this could possibly be my Edward’s father!

Also the Griffiths Records relating to the Parish of Chapelrussel not only finds an Edward, but also Bryan, John and Patrick living in the town but, by the time of the first Revision in 1855 only Bryan remains!
The following entries in the 1851-2 civil parishes of Chapelrussel and Kilronan:
Pallas (Chapelrussel)      Map Ref.   A   R   P    Description      
Edward Sheehy         44/82      0   0   0   12 shilling House
Bryan            34/21      0   0   0   12 shilling House & Yard
John                    38/65      0   0   0   12 shilling House
Patrick            47/31      0   0   0   12 shilling House
From my understanding as part of the introduction of fair rateable values for properties, regular updates were made and these were kept in Revision Books which for this parish commenced in 1857 where only one Sheehy was found, a Bryan Sheehy - Ref No: 22.  The numbering of plots and ownership changed considerably and without detailed surviving maps, it was difficult to determine.

The maps shown on askaboutireland are almost certainly later than the survey of 1851-2.  However, an alternative, undated map, which also appears to be older than the Griffith’s survey does record some of the number changes and where St. Mary’s Church is located, plot 82!

It appears plot 82 is where Edward Sheehy (1850) was living about the time of Griffiths, but as the church was built in 1863, it is most probable he has moved elsewhere. This might explain why Edward cannot be found on later property records; he had moved elsewhere?(2nd update following)

Offline Mary-Agnes

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Re: UPDATE 2 Edward Sheehy Pallaskenry town of Pallas Chapelrussel, Limerick
« Reply #8 on: Wednesday 29 January 14 14:48 GMT (UK) »
Searching of Griffith’s Revision Books at the Valuation Office in Dublin of the Griffiths Revision Books Pallaskenry DED, 1855 –2002, Parish of Chapelrussel also found the following changes to occupancy of these properties

Curiously, the following year the adjoining property is occupied by an Edmond Dalton, (baptism of Edward Sheehy February 11th 1838 mother Maria Dalton) the only Dalton name seen in the parish of Chapelrussel!  In 1892 Bryan Sheehy also occupies this House.  In 1903 both properties transfer to a Michael O’Shaughnessy.


Pallaskenry Town      Map Ref.            Description
Bryan Sheehy              23/12      to Michael Knowles        1863
Bryan Sheehy              23/22      from John Murphy        1863   10 shilling House
John Lynch                      23/23      to Edmund Dalton        1864
                                                                to Bryan Sheehy                1892
                                                                to Michael Shaughnessy   1903

Marriage record/Wills for Edward Sheehy/Maria Dalton
No Will for Edward or Maria that might have listed children could be located or a marriage or a possible death record for either, possibly due to the large numbers with the same name in the relevant District to choose from.
 
I did have another interesting find a second Army Service record for another Edward Sheehy of Ballas Kenrey, (Pallaskenry) Chapelrussel who joins the 21st Fusiliers on 10th February, 1848 aged 22 years birth abt: 1826 and is discharged on the 16th March 1869.

Can it be more than a coincidence? This Edward Sheehy gives his address in Ireland as Pallaskenry and leaves the army only 18 months before my Edward joins up. Was this possibly an uncle or cousin that Edward was influenced by to join the army himself?  Can anyone link this information with their families?
 
Many thanks Mary-Agnes