Author Topic: TARTAKOVAR family history  (Read 10677 times)

Offline M S Harmer

  • RootsChat Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 161
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: TARTAKOVAR family history
« Reply #9 on: Wednesday 20 March 19 02:52 GMT (UK) »
Hi pwh
The names Tartakover and Hart are new to us so any info would be of interest.
We are particularly interested in Isaac's marriage and his profession. From what we have found he was a journalist but need conformation as well as who for.
Also if you are interested we can give you some history on Isaac's family.

Regards Martin 
Ward, Kempson, Donovan, Kiesler, Sutherland, Anesbury, Haines, Crowle, Smith, Benfold, Binstead, Bairstow, Tullock, Wallace, Wood, Oakland, Parker, Payne, Stokes, Botten, Stacy, Brooks, Harmer, Sinclair

Offline pwh

  • RootsChat Senior
  • ****
  • Posts: 294
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: TARTAKOVAR family history
« Reply #10 on: Wednesday 20 March 19 04:39 GMT (UK) »
Martin
           Thanks for getting in touch. But first a question. There is a short reference  to  Isaac
Buchanan Sutherland in my  family history  being born in Glasgow in 1864 and marrying  Bertha
in 1901 not 1907.  So which is it?  If you go back to to the first  entry  you will see  that  Berthas
mother was French. Here are  Isaac and Berthas children.
Victor  B 1864  D  19/12/1940   M  Augusta Amelia  Harris ( 1881-1964)  1903  1S, 2D
Adrienne  Rachael,  B 1869 Vic.  D 1961 Vic.  M Samuel Warren  1 D
Eleanor  Hautiville,  B  1871 Hay NSW, D 1959  Vic.  M  Fred Oscar  Beckendorff  1894  1S
Lillien  Fluerette,  B 1875  Hay, D 1954  Carlton. MJohn James Markham  in Hay  1908.  1D
Alfred (Arthur), B Hay 1881, M  Dinah Davies.
His only child  Theodore Benjamin was the most famous of the family. He was a national  and
world class  swimmer who represented Australia in the 1908 and 1912 Olympics. He was in
fact one the first two  Australians to represent their country in officially recognized consecutive
Olympiads. I have found  photos taken of him at  the Olympic  Games. The trove sites  and
the AOC  sites mention him
Elvina Hart came from a family whose roots  i have traced back to  1743.  Many of  her
grand parents generation  were  among the early pioneers of Australia, especially  in  Melbourne
where they arrived  in 1839.  They had the first  Jewish wedding in Victoria, the first 
Jewish  funeral and the second  bar mitzvah in Victoria. Look up  Asher Hart, Ashur Hart, Edward
Hart and John Hart  on the Trove site. You will see  how  important they were in Australian
Jewish history. But more of that in other posts. And yes i would be interested in information
on the Sutherland  family. There is a Sutherland from Caithess  Scotland in my fathers  tree.
                                                                                             Pwh



Offline majm

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 25,385
  • NSW 1806 Bowman Flag Ecce signum.
    • View Profile
Re: TARTAKOVAR family history
« Reply #11 on: Wednesday 20 March 19 05:23 GMT (UK) »
I have recently discovered that a G G uncle of mine Isaac Sutherland married a
Bertha Esther Tartakover on the 1st of June 1907 in Victoria. Any background on this couple including occupations would be greatly appteciated. Sorry unable to read parents name on cert.

regards Martin

and

Martin
           Thanks for getting in touch. But first a question. There is a short reference  to  Isaac
Buchanan Sutherland in my  family history  being born in Glasgow in 1864 and marrying  Bertha
in 1901 not 1907.  So which is it?  If you go back to to the first  entry  you will see  that  Berthas
mother was French. Here are  Isaac and Berthas children.
Victor  B 1864  D  19/12/1940   M  Augusta Amelia  Harris ( 1881-1964)  1903  1S, 2D
Adrienne  Rachael,  B 1869 Vic.  D 1961 Vic.  M Samuel Warren  1 D
Eleanor  Hautiville,  B  1871 Hay NSW, D 1959  Vic.  M  Fred Oscar  Beckendorff  1894  1S
Lillien  Fluerette,  B 1875  Hay, D 1954  Carlton. MJohn James Markham  in Hay  1908.  1D
Alfred (Arthur), B Hay 1881, M  Dinah Davies.
His only child  Theodore Benjamin was the most famous of the family. He was a national  and
world class  swimmer who represented Australia in the 1908 and 1912 Olympics. He was in
fact one the first two  Australians to represent their country in officially recognized consecutive
Olympiads. I have found  photos taken of him at  the Olympic  Games. The trove sites  and
the AOC  sites mention him
Elvina Hart came from a family whose roots  i have traced back to  1743.  Many of  her
grand parents generation  were  among the early pioneers of Australia, especially  in  Melbourne
where they arrived  in 1839.  They had the first  Jewish wedding in Victoria, the first 
Jewish  funeral and the second  bar mitzvah in Victoria. Look up  Asher Hart, Ashur Hart, Edward
Hart and John Hart  on the Trove site. You will see  how  important they were in Australian
Jewish history. But more of that in other posts. And yes i would be interested in information
on the Sutherland  family. There is a Sutherland from Caithess  Scotland in my fathers  tree.
                                                                                             Pwh




The Vic BDM online index has the marriage as 1901, and the reference number as 2484.

I cannot see how Isaac and Bertha were having children back in the 1860s

JM
The information in my posts is provided for academic and non-commercial research purposes. 
Random Acts of Kindness Given Freely are never Worthless for they are Priceless.
Qui scit et non docet.    Qui docet et non vivit.    Qui nescit et non interrogat.   
All Census Look Ups Are Crown Copyright from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
I do not have a face book or a twitter account.

Offline majm

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 25,385
  • NSW 1806 Bowman Flag Ecce signum.
    • View Profile
Re: TARTAKOVAR family history
« Reply #12 on: Wednesday 20 March 19 05:45 GMT (UK) »
According to the Vic BDM online index, Bertha Esther TARTAKOVER’s birth registration is 18494/1867,  and she was born at St Kilda.  Her parents are recorded there as Elvina HART and Michael TARTAKOVER.   If this is the lass who married Isaac SUTHERLAND, then that list from Paul cannot be the children of Isaac and Bertha... 

Perhaps it would be best if you both double check before much more is published on this public forum. 

JM
The information in my posts is provided for academic and non-commercial research purposes. 
Random Acts of Kindness Given Freely are never Worthless for they are Priceless.
Qui scit et non docet.    Qui docet et non vivit.    Qui nescit et non interrogat.   
All Census Look Ups Are Crown Copyright from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
I do not have a face book or a twitter account.


Offline whiteout7

  • RootsChat Aristocrat
  • ******
  • Posts: 1,948
    • View Profile
Re: TARTAKOVAR family history
« Reply #13 on: Wednesday 20 March 19 07:52 GMT (UK) »
Alfred (Arthur), B Hay 1881, M  Dinah Davies.
His only child  Theodore Benjamin was the most famous of the family. He was a national  and world class  swimmer who represented Australia in the 1908 and 1912 Olympics. He was in fact one the first two  Australians to represent their country in officially recognized consecutive Olympiads. I have found  photos taken of him at  the Olympic  Games. The trove sites and the AOC  sites mention him

There are more birth registrations for Alfred Tartakover and Dinah - Hay at the NSWBDM in Australia - So not an only child?

TARTAKOVER THEODORE BENJAMIN 16346/1880 ALFRED - DINAH - HAY

TARTAKOVER  AUGUSTUS M 10970/1882 ALFRED - DINAH - HAY

TARTAKOVER  CELESTINE 14416/1886 ALFRED - DINAH - HAY

Amending, adding

TARTAKOVER ALBERT JOHN ABRAHAM 11255/1872 ALFRED - DINAH - HAY

TARTAKOVER  FLEURETTE 12009/1873 ALFRED - DINAH - HAY

TARTAKOVER  EUGENE H 12801/1875 ALFRED - DINAH - HAY

TARTAKOVER  CATHERINE R 13463/1877 ALFRED - DINAH - HAY





In a census Augustus Mitchell Tartakover was born in Italy, New South Wales Australia in about 1881. In NZ Archives he then dies in Rotorua, New Zealand in 1964 (He was a Retired Wool Buyer). AM Tartakover's wifes name was Emily Ida Tartakover (Nee Walker) she died in 1974. According to NSWBDM  Augustus Tartakover and Emily Walker were marrried in Sydney in 1913

4083/1913 TARTAKOVER AUGUSTUS M - WALKER EMILY I - SYDNEY

Where Did Dinah marry Alfred Tartakover?





Wemyss/Crombie/Laing/Blyth (West Wemyss)
Givens/Normand (Dysart)
Clark/Lister (Dysart)
Wilkinson/Simson (Kettle or Kettlehill)

Offline whiteout7

  • RootsChat Aristocrat
  • ******
  • Posts: 1,948
    • View Profile
Re: TARTAKOVAR family history
« Reply #14 on: Wednesday 20 March 19 07:58 GMT (UK) »
"TARTAKOVER–DAVIES.—On the 28th ult., at the
Synagogue, Stephen-street, by the Rev. M. Rintel,
Alfred, of Hay, New South Wales, eldest son of M.
Tartakover, Esq., to Dinah, youngest daughter of
John Davies, Esq., Fitzroy. Adelaide and Sydney
papers please copy. No cards." - Trove Au 1871

https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/5850804

Ok: She was Dinah Davies and Alfred Tartakover was of Hay, in New South Wales Australia. I still think they had more (amended) children though

Wemyss/Crombie/Laing/Blyth (West Wemyss)
Givens/Normand (Dysart)
Clark/Lister (Dysart)
Wilkinson/Simson (Kettle or Kettlehill)

Offline M S Harmer

  • RootsChat Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 161
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: TARTAKOVAR family history
« Reply #15 on: Wednesday 20 March 19 08:09 GMT (UK) »
Isaac (1930) and Bertha (1924) both died without issue.
Married 1june 1901 Christ Church, South Yarra.
Also Isaac's middle name would have been Buchan not Buchanan, his mother's name was Mary Buchan
Regards
Ward, Kempson, Donovan, Kiesler, Sutherland, Anesbury, Haines, Crowle, Smith, Benfold, Binstead, Bairstow, Tullock, Wallace, Wood, Oakland, Parker, Payne, Stokes, Botten, Stacy, Brooks, Harmer, Sinclair

Offline whiteout7

  • RootsChat Aristocrat
  • ******
  • Posts: 1,948
    • View Profile
Re: TARTAKOVAR family history
« Reply #16 on: Wednesday 20 March 19 08:22 GMT (UK) »

Eleanor  Hautiville,  B  1871 Hay NSW, D 1959 
Lillien  Fluerette,  B 1875  Hay, D 1954  Carlton.
                                                                                             Pwh

Double checking birth registrations at the NSWBDM

*TARTAKOVER ELEANOR HAUTVILLE 11377/1871 (father) MITCHELL (Mother) ELVINA (registered in) HAY

TARTAKOVER ISABELLA BLANCHE 11916/1873 MITCHELL - ELVINA - HAY

*TARTAKOVER  LILIAN FLORETTE 12379/1874 (Father)MITCHELL - (Mother) ELVINA - (Registered in) HAY

TARTAKOVER  HENRY A 13390/1877 MITCHELL - ELVINA - HAY

TARTAKOVER  UNNAMED 14538/1878 MITCHELL - ELVIRA HART -HAY

Think I'd be rechecking everything that happened in New South Wales through official government sources https://www.bdm.nsw.gov.au/Pages/family-history-research/family-history-search.aspx



Wemyss/Crombie/Laing/Blyth (West Wemyss)
Givens/Normand (Dysart)
Clark/Lister (Dysart)
Wilkinson/Simson (Kettle or Kettlehill)

Offline whiteout7

  • RootsChat Aristocrat
  • ******
  • Posts: 1,948
    • View Profile
Re: TARTAKOVAR family history
« Reply #17 on: Wednesday 20 March 19 08:26 GMT (UK) »
Isaac (1930) and Bertha (1924) both died without issue.
Married 1june 1901 Christ Church, South Yarra.
Also Isaac's middle name would have been Buchan not Buchanan, his mother's name was Mary Buchan
Regards

Makes sense
Wemyss/Crombie/Laing/Blyth (West Wemyss)
Givens/Normand (Dysart)
Clark/Lister (Dysart)
Wilkinson/Simson (Kettle or Kettlehill)