TARTAKOVAR family history

[M S Harmer]

Firstly William Alexander Sutherland was born 12 Jan  1882 to a James' Sutherland and Martha Tulloch in Gilberton S.A.
James and Martha arrived in S.A. on board the Barque The Oakland's in 1877. This can be verified online.
I am also in possession of a journal written by Isaac's oldest brother William on their voyage to Australia from Glasgow. Isaac is mentioned in said journal along with elizabeth, James', Jessie (first marriage, Mary Buchan), Martha and David, (second marriage Martha Tulloch) As well as William Alexander Margaret Annie and John Donald were born in S.A.

[majm]

Firstly William Alexander Sutherland was born 12 Jan  1882 to a James' Sutherland and Martha Tulloch in Gilberton S.A.
James and Martha arrived in S.A. on board the Barque The Oakland's in 1877. This can be verified online.
I am also in possession of a journal written by Isaac's oldest brother William on their voyage to Australia from Glasgow. Isaac is mentioned in said journal along with elizabeth, James', Jessie (first marriage, Mary Buchan), Martha and David, (second marriage Martha Tulloch) As well as William Alexander Margaret Annie and John Donald were born in S.A.

Please check your records, and look for Isaac's oldest brother as William .... also note that the Isaac SUTHERLAND on board that voyage was recorded as ENGLISH. 

http://www.theshipslist.com/ships/australia/oaklands1877.shtml

Sutherland J, aged 45, a Compositor, with wife and three children.
Sutherland J, aged 19, Die-Sinker
Sutherland J, aged 13.


https://www.archives.sa.gov.au/passenger-lists-view/1877/
and the pdf of the image of the passengers disembarked …
https://www.archives.sa.gov.au/sites/default/files/documentstore/passengerlists/1877/GRG35_48_1_77-22_Oaklands.pdf

Sutherland: family
 James, 45, Compositor , SCOTCH male
Martha, 35, SCOTCH  female
Jessie, 6, a SCOTCH child
Martha, 5, a SCOTCH child
David, 1, a SCOTCH child

Sutherland : Single Men
James, 19, Die sinker, ENGLISH
Isaac, 13, ENGLISH

ADD
Also, the voyage was from Plymouth, Devon, England,  not from Glasgow...

JM

[M S Harmer]

Correction, the voyage started in Glasgow on board a ship called The Toward. The Toward travelled from Scotland to Plymouth. There was also a stop over in Ireland.
Why they say Isaac and James' is a mystery but I have come across this error before.

[majm]

Correction, the voyage started in Glasgow on board a ship called The Toward. The Toward travelled from Scotland to Plymouth. There was also a stop over in Ireland.
Why they say Isaac and James' is a mystery but I have come across this error before.

How are you so sure it is an error.  What document/s gives you confidence that that is 'your' Isaac.

JM

[majm]

Familysearch has an online index for 1871 Scottish Census…  it shows there are 11,585 entries for the surname SUTHERLAND on that set of 1871 records.
https://www.familysearch.org/search/collection/results?count=20&query=%2Bsurname%3Asutherland~&collection_id=2028678

Perhaps this is that family at 152 Duke St, Glasgow…
James SUTHERLAND, 40, head (of household) married,  born Edinburgh, a Printer Reader
Martha SUTHERLAND, 29,  his wife, born Lochgilphead,
Elizabeth SUTHERLAND, 16, daughter, Milliner, born Edinburgh
James SUTHERLAND, 14, son, scholar born Glasgow
Isaac SUTHERLAND, 7, son, Scholar, born Glasgow
Jessie SUTHERLAND, 1, daughter, born Glasgow
Those ages are not exact matches, but …. Perhaps that is understandable if money was ‘tight’ and the shipping line was charging based on the age of the passengers to reflect the mess expenses.

https://www.nrscotland.gov.uk/files//research/census-records/street-indexes/1871/1871-glasgow.pdf  According to that pdf, the enumeration book would be numbered 61, The Regn Dist would be 644-2

Here is a very long thread re a search on RChat for an Isaac SUTHERLAND, of Caithness. The Opening post mentions BUCHANAN and immigration to Australia in 1854.   

https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=444205.0

Martin,  in my opinion, the dots are simply NOT joining up, and they are so widely scattered.  Glasgow is not anywhere near Caithness which was a county and it is still hundreds of miles from Glasgow, which is a city in a different county, and Edinburgh is a different city again, and is no where near either Glasgow or Caithness.   So in the 1800s records there’s Caithness, and there’s Lanarkshire and there’s Midlothian to check through at least. 

ADD
So from familysearch, there’s a birth showing for 27 June 1863 for an Isaac SUTHERLAND, parents as James SUTHERLAND and Mary BUCHAN… with birthplace as Glasgow. https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:FQ52-LFZ
Scotland’s people have a birth registration,  just the one in the years 1863-1865 … for Isaac SUTHERLAND
https://www.scotlandspeople.gov.uk/search-our-records   

What information is on that birth certificate that would show James SUTHERLAND who migrated to South Australia in 1877 as his father?  ....  the Dad's Occupation ... will be useful   That still does not sort the 'ENGLISH' 13 year old lad on that same voyage... but it does put some more dots on the line between William Alexander SUTHERLAND and Isaac Buchan SUTHERLAND ....

JM
 

[majm]

......
So, from Bertha’s 1901 marriage cert, which is a Victorian BDM document, so very detailed, what is the exact information that that document records that her husband, Isaac SUTHERLAND gave about himself and about both his parents …  If it is difficult to decipher,  I am absolutely certain that RChat’s rules allow for a snip of the relevant section to be uploaded as an attachment.

JM

[M S Harmer]

His occupation was compositor. Married in Glasgow 29 March 1866
His father was a shoe maker. Mother's maiden name was Sinclair.
Just a little info I recently received from my cousin in Wagga who has had her Sutherland DNA researched our Sutherland and Sinclair lines seems to hail from the Caithness region.

[majm]

His occupation was compositor. Married in Glasgow 29 March 1866
His father was a shoe maker. Mother's maiden name was Sinclair.
Just a little info I recently received from my cousin in Wagga who has had her Sutherland DNA researched our Sutherland and Sinclair lines seems to hail from the Caithness region.

So are you saying that you have a Scotlands Peoples birth certificate showing Isaac born 1863,  and it has  all the details for him,  including his dad is noted on it as a compositor,  and his grandad is detailed on it too.... and parents date of marriage ..   what else is on that birth registration ....please check carefully

JM

[majm]

Here is an INDEX listing for Martha TULLOCHs marriage to James SUTHERLAND on 30 March 1866.

https://familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:XTY4-Y4P


It is my understanding that the results of DNA tests offered by the family history websites are not yet able to positively identify any particular Scottish region for any person's DNA much less determine which particular surname belongs to what part  of the DNA submitted for testing. 

JM