Passenger list for INDIAN QUEEN 1857

[Lucy2]

Probate file at Archives NZ, ChCh for >

LINDNER - James - Christchurch - Retired Engineer -- 1940

[patsymac]

Okay will have to get my head around all this Luc 

So we are saying that Ruth MASON (hopefully daughter of Mary Ann and John MASON) had a son    William Alfred who was  illegitimate?? son of Ruth Mason?? Ruth then ended up 'living' with James Lindner rather than marrying him?? (runs in the family it seems)  I am certainly more than happy to scrabble around in the Parish Register card index and at Archives next week to see what I can find out.  Hopefully it will sort itself into a nice package for us (Tui moment there)    The only marriage I can see is a Emelia Augusta Mason to a William Douglas in 1872??  Not Ruth thats for sure but maybe some 'goings on' ?    AND it seems William buried with his grandmother perhaps.  And i think that maybe Ruth was alternating between the Douglas / Lindner name because of her son maybe?? cheers and thanks

[Lucy2]

So we are saying that Ruth MASON (hopefully daughter of Mary Ann and John MASON) had a son    William Alfred who was  illegitimate?? son of Ruth Mason?? Ruth then ended up 'living' with James Lindner rather than marrying him?? (runs in the family it seems) 

 AND it seems William buried with his grandmother perhaps.  And i think that maybe Ruth was alternating between the Douglas / Lindner name because of her son maybe?? cheers and thanks

Hi Patsy

Blimey ... long time since I've been on such a circuitous route (though a lot of this has been eliminating others).    
But yes, feeling a lot more positive now about this Mary Ann MASON / Ruth LINDNER
connection.

*  Mary Ann MASON death notice (ChCh) 1897 (age at death more or less right).

*  That death notice identifies a daughter "Mrs" James LINDER (whom it transpires is named Ruth - which is a MASON / and LEIGHTON family name).

*  Mary Ann buried with William Alfred DOUGLAS (bc 1876 at Wellington according to his cemetery record).

*  William Alfred DOUGLAS seems most likely to be the child born 1876 to Ruth MASON (as MASON - William Alfred Douglas - father N/R) ... and his death notice 1915 identifies his mother as Ruth DOUGLAS at 153 Lichfield Street, ChCh.
(No Ruth DOUGLAS at that address on e/rolls but a Ruth LINDNER is, in 1914).

*  Cemetery record 1940 (Linwood, ChCh) shows Ruth LINDNER was born c. 1858 in England  ... and years in NZ puts arrival c. 1860 (which is not far off arrival of the "Kinnaird" 1859 Wellington. )

Fingers crossed then.   

   ~  Lu 

[Lucy2]

... just digressing  ... seems that Elizabeth Ann MASON had a daughter born 1876 (presumably also at Wellington).   Lilian Maud MASON (reg'd. 1876) went on to become "JENKINS" (Elizabeth Ann's married name), and wed a McFARLANE.
JENKINS (Elizabeth Ann/ husband/son) and McFARLANE's in same large family plot at Karori, Wellington.

[Lucy2]

  The only marriage I can see is a Emelia Augusta Mason to a William Douglas in 1872?? 

The above (shown on birth reg's for children as "Amelia") I think we can rule out.
Looks like they resided in Northland (Marsden) electorate mostly.  She died 1924 (bc 1857).

[Lucy2]

Hi Patsy

Have just been revisiting the info previously dug up for James DONNELLY (a.k.a. Police Sergeant James DONNELLY / Constable DONNELLY).

In particular was the item from "Wanganui Herald" - 20 January 1879 -- Court appearance of Sergeant DONNELLY and Constable BUCHANAN  ... where it was said that DONNELLY had elected to separate from his wife. 

James DONNELLY's obituary (the "Manawatu Times" version - June 1900), stated that he'd previously been stationed at Palmerston North and Wanganui (among other places).  [Found in newspapers - July 1877 - James DONNELLY, Constable at Palmerston North ... and in 1878 and later, Sergeant DONNELLY at Wanganui.]

I mention the above years, because also found in school prize-giving lists, is a child named "Marshall DONNELLY" ??  ["Manawatu Times" - 31 March 1877 - Palmerston North school ... and "Wanganui Herald" - 21 June 1878 - p. 2 --  a pupil at Wanganui Grammar School. ]   Now surely there is only one Marshall DONNELLY ?  [Can't see another in newspapers / NZ BMD etc. etc. ]

    ~  Lu
 

[Lucy2]

... anyway, the following is just "my take" on what may have happened.   
[Now that we have some new info to hand. ]

*  That during her time in Molesworth Street and the troubles she faced (poor woman, it must have been one hell of struggle for her as a widow), Mary Ann MASON had some of her children removed from her care and sent off to live with others.

*  Marshall John MASON (later Donnelly) is raised (probably from at least 1877) by (Sergeant) James DONNELLY and his (real) wife, (also) named Mary Ann.
[I think you were right earlier when you said how unlikely it seemed that James DONNELLY would have had a relationship with Mary Ann MASON.]

*  James DONNELLY (Policeman) may have been in Wellington area prior to going to Palmerston c. 1877 ?

*  James DONNELLY and (real) wife Mary Ann, obviously reconcile at some point after their 1879 Wanganui incident.   [I now think she is the Mary Ann DONNELLY on e/rolls in Wellington at Webb Street with Marshall.   And although not mentioned in James DONNELLY's obit, she is probably the person who placed the "In Memoriam" notice (from wife and son) in 1901.   We know now she is the Mary Ann (nee FOX) who goes on marry William BROWN (Nov. 1901) - so is likely the same Mary Ann FOX who married a James DONNELLY in 1864. ]

*  ... "my dear wife Mary Ann DONNELLY" ... who was left an interest in the Estate of James DONNELLY (will dated 1898), is seemingly his legal wife, Mary Ann (nee FOX) ?
------------------

Gee ... why couldn't DONNELLY's wife have been named something other than "Mary Ann" ??       Woulda saved us an awful lot of head-scratching ...   

[patsymac]

Hi Luc, yes she really must have had an awful time but do you think it is her that they talk about as having a house of ill repute? I have a sneaky suspicion that it just might be.  I wonder if she lost all the children mind you by 1877 the older ones were getting old enough and maybe that is why our Helena ended up in Napier??? she may have gone to her older brother William who was married and living in Napier. Wm and his wife were witneses at Helena's marriage. There is also a son Robert (the youngest) but dont know what happened to him as yet. 
Okay maybe this time we have sorted them out.  Its a bit of a giggle really because when I first started researching this family Mary Ann MASON's burial was one of the first I looked at because all the rest of the family seemed to come from ChCh (they were VERY early arrivals here) so thought that she might be in the family then of course found the Wellington connection and low and behold she just might be a connection after all?? full circle maybe??  I follow you on the James Donnelly/Mary ANn thing and like you say why didnt he marry someone called Stephanie or something  would have made it so much easier to unravel it all.  I cant thank you enough for your help there is no way I could have done this without your assistance. I will let you know what I find at the Library and Archives - cheers

[patsymac]

Just had an email from Archives the Will is waiting for me so thats good.  Also just wondering what made Mary Ann head to Christchurch??   Maybe it just got too hot for her in Wellington and maybe she just thought she could straighten herself out if she came down south??? the poor woman really got herself into strife if everything I have read in the papers is right. Seems it may have started as early as 1872 then went downhill from there.  We do have the right person of course because of that Court Case regarding her son in law William Jenkins so no doubt really is there? cheers