Jennis/Gennis family

[Edrubava]

Thanks Valda - I do have them in the 61.  They had 2 daughters that died as infants, both named Catherine; one daughter Martha who died at 19; then I know the history of son William (my g grandfather) as he walks to Northants then marries and has children there.  Catherine's William marries again and I can find them in 81 and 91 then no trace of either.

I appreciate your help Valda, and I realise that I may never find any of these deaths (not sure why though)

Like everyone else's family history, the stories get a bit convoluted as we try to pin them down.

Regards
Julie

[Valda]

Hi

Breakdown of their marriages, possible but as yet unproven bigamy, illiteracy and an unusual surname the officials did their best with are probably the main reasons some of the family are difficult to follow, John Francis being no different from two of his sisters as far as his marriage was concerned.


John Francis Gennis' death registration was in 1909 March quarter Camberwell registration district volume 1d page 57? He was aged 58.

This may be him in the 1901 census RG13 368 folio 73
26 Shipton Street St George the Martyr Southwark
John Gennis 50 Head Married Boot Machinist Whitechapel London
Mary Gennis 43 Wife Married Brompton London
Thomas Kimble 21 Stepson Boot salesman Soho London
Charles Kimble 18 Stepson Metal Polisher Soho London

Could be Kemble

1891 census RG12 83 folio 118
12 Mills Buildings Knightsbridge Westminster
In the household of George Hemingway and his family
John Gennis 40 Lodger Single Boot Clicker N. K. London


Did wonder even whether Jane's death was registered as Jennings in 1871 in Whitechapel aged 65.


Regards

Valda

[jennifer c]

St luke Finsbury 20/2/1865

John Gennis bach Boot closer father William - Shoe maker

Jemima Rance both of Little Arthur Street can not read fathers details?

Witnesses William & Fanny Gennis

Jennifer

[Edrubava]

I've had a busy couple of days, so will digest the latest info soon.

Thanks again 

[Edrubava]

Many thanks again Valda and Jennifer - I can't seem to find the time that I want to spend on my elusive lot lately 


I looked at the William Jenness death but unfortunately it's a mistranscription - it's actually Jenner (William Jenner of that age traceable)  and the name underneath is Jenness.

Now I have the explanation as to why I couldn't find John Francis's death - his age was 10 years out, so whenever I searched and put in his correct birth date I didn't find it.  Thank you again.  I'll also look into the John and Mary that you detail.

There are still the other things to look at - but I have found previously a William Brock Jennis (no relation apparently) who is in the Royal Navy - so wondered if he's anything to do with the other marriage that you found in 1872 - with father of the groom described as 'Captain of Merchant Vessel' 

As you say Valda - marriage break ups, illiteracy etc all point to confusion later on 

I'll just keep digging and hope for a breakthough one day 

[Valda]

Hi

As I said I have wondered how far the surname can be misspelt as the only near death registration for Jane in Whitechapel registration district is Jane Jennings March quarter 1871 aged 65.
That might account for why the registrations are hard to find but expensive to prove one way or the other and could just be wasting money since surnames like Jennings and Jenner aren't rare so it could just as easily be someone called Jenner  and Jennings. Jenner is a nearer misspelling since it could be only one letter away - Jennes.

The older typed GRO indexes are not the originals which were handwritten and thrown away. As they began to fall apart temp typists were used (unfamiliar with older handwriting) to transfer the information to typed volumes. There was no checking that this typing was done completely accurately. I don't know the date when the GRO volumes ceased to be handwritten and original volumes were typed from the onset.


London Gazette 1878
William Brock Jennis Paymaster in Her Majesty's Fleet

http://www.london-gazette.co.uk/issues/24605/pages/4154/page.pdf

He married in the Bristol area in 1870
1871 census RG10 988 folio 119
Born Gillingham Kent circa 1843
He seems to have left the navy (always in an administrative capacity) by 1881 RG11 733 folio 132 with wife and children.
Baptism in Gillingham

https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/J9ZD-MJM

I can't see how this man could be connected to the 1872 marriage. His father, also called William, seems to have been born in Gillingham circa 1802. Neither seem to have any connection to shoemaking.


Regards

Valda

[Edrubava]

Yes, I think I'll probably order the Jane Jennings certificate - and as you have reminded me - it's an unusual name and misspellings must be common - I should know that from the number of times I've found mistakes in other surnames as well.

Even the William Jenner could be my William.

I think I'll take it slowly and order some of the 'close' death certificates over the next couple of months and see how I go 

Once you put it all into context Valda, concerning temp typists unused to older handwriting, I can see why it can be so difficult to trace some family members. 

I think I've just stumbled on Jemima Jennis in the '91 after searching for ages - on A.......y she is Jemima Gaines and tagged on with another family name, and on The G........t she is Jemima Guines.  I'm almost 100% sure it's her because of her son's names.

So, another lesson learned - just because you can't find the actual correct surname, it doesn't mean they ain't there   

Many thanks again Valda.

[Valda]

Hi

Both the Jennings and the Jenner death certificates are risky. They could so easily just be a Jennings and a Jenner but they are both in the right registration district at the right time and deaths needed to be registered for a burial to go ahead so if not these then some other spelling variation.


Regards

Valda

[Edrubava]

Hello again

I'm still on the trail of the deaths that I can't find - I've just received the certificate that could have been promising:

William Jenner (transcribed as Jenness) 1883 London city - only to find that it is definitely William Jenner living in Garlick Hill with son William  who registered the death.  Can find them on the '71 and '81.  Worth a try though!

Thanks to Valda a possible marriage for the old William Jennis (b 1809 Ireland) in Clapham to Emma Maria Wright 1872 was found - they are together on the '81 under Geinees. The are living at 9 Mary Ann Street, St George in the East, where Emma Maria and first husband Gilbert were living in the '61, and widowed Emma and children on the '71.

I have also found William Jennis on the voters lists from 1875 to 1883 at 9 Mary Ann Street.  Neither he nor Emma Maria can be found on the'91 but Emma Maria's death is registered later that year. 

Did all males have the vote in the 19th century?  Is it likely that William and Emma owned 9 Mary Ann Street?

Last question - is it just likely to be down to spelling mistakes that I can't find some of my Jennis/Gennis deaths?

I appreciate the help I've had already, thank you - any other ideas??!!