Author Topic: Chirk Families: HUGHES, JONES, CASH in late 1700s, early 1800s  (Read 5794 times)

Offline evan2wo

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Chirk Families: HUGHES, JONES, CASH in late 1700s, early 1800s
« on: Saturday 15 September 12 22:33 BST (UK) »
I am looking for feedback on my research regarding the ancestry of Job JONES, bapt. Black Park, Chirk on May 3, 1829.  He was the son of John JONES (also born in Chirk), a collier, and Elizabeth.  I know from Census records in Wales in 1841 and England in 1851 (Bilston, Staffordshire) that John Jones and Elizabeth were born around 1802-1806.  The most likely match I have located for his parents show them as getting married August 16, 1824 in Chirk - with Elizabeth's maiden name given as CASH.  Witnesses were Griffith OWENS and Martha CASH.

Prior to this marriage on August 16, 1824, it appears one Elizabeth CASH of Black Park, Chirk, had two children out of wedlock - Priscilla, bapt. June 2, 1822, and Ephraim, bapt. June 13, 1824.  Priscilla is found as Priscilla JONES, living with the family in 1841. 

As for Elizabeth CASH's baptismal record, I can find none.  I imagine she would have been born to Edward and Anne (FRANCIS) CASH of Black Park who married in 1790.  There is a Martha CASH who was born 1799 to Edward and Mary in "Prinkinally," but I suspect this is an error and it is actually Edward and Anne from Brynkinalt (which I think included Black Park at one point, correct?).  Edward (born ca. 1755) likely married once before and had a son Edward (b. ca. 1782), who is the one who married Mary MORRIS in 1805, and then left her a widow in 1819.  They lived in Halton. 

As for the baptismal record of Elizabeth CASH's husband, John JONES, the best match appears to be John JONES, born Sept. 8, 1804, bapt. Feb. 10, 1805 in Chirk (no further neighborhood info. given), with parents John and Elizabeth.  The only other John Jones born in Chirk around 1802-1805 was one with parents John and Elizabeth, but living in Pennyclawd. 

The best match for this John and Elizabeth appears to be a marriage occurring in Chirk on Sept. 13, 1794. (I note it seems unusual a son John would not have been born to them until ten years later - but if there were a couple of children who died young they could have named another one John, correct?).  This John JONES was born in Llangollen, and married Elizabeth HUGHES from the Chirk parrish.  Both signed their names, rather than by mark (not clear on significance of this - as I have seen in the USA sometimes people would sign by mark one time, and by signature another).  Witnesses John HUGHES and Ann HUGHES.  At first I thought they would be the likely parents of Elizabeth. However, I could find no children in Chirk born to a John and Ann HUGHES around that time.  Then I came across a marriage record from 1790 in Chirk, where a John HUGHES married an Ann JONES.  Was it common for siblings to sign as witnesses along with their spouses?  Were there unwritten rules for who would witness a marriage in this area?  John Hughes signed his own 1790 marriage record very neatly.  It is similar, but by no means identical, and less stylized than the John Hughes who witnessed the 1794 marriage.

Looking at baptismal records in Chirk for Elizabeth HUGHES around the 1770s (assuming she was around 18-22 when married) I see an Elizabeth born 1775 to John and Mary, and also one baptized in 1772 to Edward and Mary. 

I have dead-ended with John JONES of Llangollen, except that the name Job appears in the family which is not that common for the region, and there does appear to have been a Job JONES - or a few, who lived in Llangollen, and also had a presence in Ruabon. 

Also, it does appear John and Elizabeth (CASH) JONES had at least one child prior to Job who was born in 1829.  (Not counting the two Elizabeth CASH had before marrying John in 1824.)  John JONES, bapt. Feb. 9, 1828, son of John and Elizabeth of Chirk, died one month later (record specified one month of age) on March 9, 1828 in Black Park. 

Again, any feedback and additional information would be appreciated concerning the above families.




 




Offline wrjones

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Re: Chirk Families: HUGHES, JONES, CASH in late 1700s, early 1800s
« Reply #1 on: Saturday 15 September 12 23:07 BST (UK) »
The John Jones of interest to me is showing in 1851 as born in Glyndfrdwy in c 1801 with a wife Elizabeth given as born in Chirk in c 1803.HO107/1993/791/10.

Regards
William Russell Jones.
Jones, Griffiths. Stephens, Parry, Gabriel, Conway, Hughes, Evans, Roberts, Lea, Hanmer. Peake, Edwards. Newnes, Davies. Thomas. "Blythin".
All North Wales.
Conway, Durber, Cartlidge, Lovatt, Bebington. Brindley, Sankey, Brunt. Dean. Clewes. Rhodes. Mountford,Walker,Bache, "Gibbons"Hood. Taylor
All Stoke-on-Trent.
Francis - Nantwich Cheshire.
Dennell - Cheshire/Staffordshire.
Talbot-Shropshire
Census Information Is Crown Copyright,from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline wrjones

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Re: Chirk Families: HUGHES, JONES, CASH in late 1700s, early 1800s
« Reply #2 on: Saturday 15 September 12 23:51 BST (UK) »
Turning now to the Job Jones'.There are two showing in the 1841 Census.One as you say given as born in c 1829 the son of a John and Elizabeth Jones.However there is another one given as born in c 1830 the son of a John and Ann Jones.

The one son of John and Ann Jones is still with his parents in Chirk in 1851.There is no sign of the other one.

Regards
William Russell Jones.

Jones, Griffiths. Stephens, Parry, Gabriel, Conway, Hughes, Evans, Roberts, Lea, Hanmer. Peake, Edwards. Newnes, Davies. Thomas. "Blythin".
All North Wales.
Conway, Durber, Cartlidge, Lovatt, Bebington. Brindley, Sankey, Brunt. Dean. Clewes. Rhodes. Mountford,Walker,Bache, "Gibbons"Hood. Taylor
All Stoke-on-Trent.
Francis - Nantwich Cheshire.
Dennell - Cheshire/Staffordshire.
Talbot-Shropshire
Census Information Is Crown Copyright,from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline evan2wo

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Re: Chirk Families: HUGHES, JONES, CASH in late 1700s, early 1800s
« Reply #3 on: Sunday 16 September 12 00:08 BST (UK) »
Yes, Job Jones, son of John and Elizabeth, was married and living in Bilston, Staffordshire with his parents by 1851.


Offline wrjones

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Re: Chirk Families: HUGHES, JONES, CASH in late 1700s, early 1800s
« Reply #4 on: Sunday 16 September 12 00:19 BST (UK) »
Yes I see him now living with his parents and Rosannah in 1851 in Bilston.

Regards
William Russell Jones.
Jones, Griffiths. Stephens, Parry, Gabriel, Conway, Hughes, Evans, Roberts, Lea, Hanmer. Peake, Edwards. Newnes, Davies. Thomas. "Blythin".
All North Wales.
Conway, Durber, Cartlidge, Lovatt, Bebington. Brindley, Sankey, Brunt. Dean. Clewes. Rhodes. Mountford,Walker,Bache, "Gibbons"Hood. Taylor
All Stoke-on-Trent.
Francis - Nantwich Cheshire.
Dennell - Cheshire/Staffordshire.
Talbot-Shropshire
Census Information Is Crown Copyright,from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline wrjones

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Re: Chirk Families: HUGHES, JONES, CASH in late 1700s, early 1800s
« Reply #5 on: Sunday 16 September 12 00:26 BST (UK) »
I wonder whether you have given much thought to another Job Jones born in Chirk living in Rowley Regis Staffordshire in 1851.He is given as born in Chirk in c 1794 and married to a Maria given as born in Rowley Regis in c 1785.

Regards
William Russell Jones.
Jones, Griffiths. Stephens, Parry, Gabriel, Conway, Hughes, Evans, Roberts, Lea, Hanmer. Peake, Edwards. Newnes, Davies. Thomas. "Blythin".
All North Wales.
Conway, Durber, Cartlidge, Lovatt, Bebington. Brindley, Sankey, Brunt. Dean. Clewes. Rhodes. Mountford,Walker,Bache, "Gibbons"Hood. Taylor
All Stoke-on-Trent.
Francis - Nantwich Cheshire.
Dennell - Cheshire/Staffordshire.
Talbot-Shropshire
Census Information Is Crown Copyright,from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline evan2wo

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Re: Chirk Families: HUGHES, JONES, CASH in late 1700s, early 1800s
« Reply #6 on: Sunday 16 September 12 01:26 BST (UK) »
I have.  I am guessing he is one and the same with Job JONES bapt. March 6, in 1795 in Llangollen.  That is near Chirk Castle, correct?  He is the only Job JONES I see in baptismal records from Denbigshire born around 1794.  The others are in 1792 in Wrexham, and 1800 in Ruabon. If the one in Llangollen is one and the same with the one you mentioned, his parents would be Job Jones of Ruabon, collier, and wife Elizabeth.  It appears he was born "Jan 30 last ano" (which I assume means 1794).  I wonder if he is the *much* younger brother to John JONES of Llangollen who married in Sept. 1794.  Did the family move from Ruabon to Llangollen in 1794, or was it customary to simply state the town the father was from in baptismal records.  I have only recently started looking through Welsh records, so this is still quite new to me.   

Offline wrjones

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Re: Chirk Families: HUGHES, JONES, CASH in late 1700s, early 1800s
« Reply #7 on: Sunday 16 September 12 09:34 BST (UK) »
Did the John Jones(Llangollen) make it to 1841-51?

Regards
William Russell Jones.
Jones, Griffiths. Stephens, Parry, Gabriel, Conway, Hughes, Evans, Roberts, Lea, Hanmer. Peake, Edwards. Newnes, Davies. Thomas. "Blythin".
All North Wales.
Conway, Durber, Cartlidge, Lovatt, Bebington. Brindley, Sankey, Brunt. Dean. Clewes. Rhodes. Mountford,Walker,Bache, "Gibbons"Hood. Taylor
All Stoke-on-Trent.
Francis - Nantwich Cheshire.
Dennell - Cheshire/Staffordshire.
Talbot-Shropshire
Census Information Is Crown Copyright,from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline evan2wo

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Re: Chirk Families: HUGHES, JONES, CASH in late 1700s, early 1800s
« Reply #8 on: Monday 17 September 12 19:17 BST (UK) »
I do not have enough information on John and Elizabeth, parents of John bapt. 1805 in Chirk, to make any conclusions.  There is a John Jones b. ca. 1775 living a few doors down from the family in 1841, but that says he was not born in Debingshire and was receiving an Army pension.