Author Topic: FRASER/FRAZER/FRAISER- Can you Help Please !!  (Read 6653 times)

Offline Faysie

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Re: FRASER/FRAZER/FRAISER- Can you Help Please !!
« Reply #18 on: Thursday 13 September 12 04:01 BST (UK) »
ooops !!! I forgot to ask. Hugh Frazer seems to have died in the Dec Quarter in Maer in 1837... Can some one please tell me how I go about ordering his Death Record...I don't think you can get a Death Certificate for that period.

Thanks'
Faysie

Sach/Saich- Essex.
Kent & North Family - Hampshire.
Burke- Co Galway Ireland
Sharp/e- Sth Kyme-Pinchbeck & Blankney, Spalding- Lincolnshire, also Dorrington , Holland fen & Leicestershire.
Peck, Welbourn & Leadenha Lincolnshire
Plowright - Pinchbeck. Lincolnshire
Higman & Seldon Family- Stoke Damerol. Devon.
Freebody -Middlesex-London
Gravel- Prestwich. Manch-Lancashire
Fraser/Frazer- Salford  Manch Lancashire &  Staffordshire
Berry- Bollington. Cheshire
Micklethwaite -Stalybridge & Tintwhistl

Offline linell

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Re: FRASER/FRAZER/FRAISER- Can you Help Please !!
« Reply #19 on: Thursday 13 September 12 05:56 BST (UK) »
http://www.staffordshirebmd.org.uk/cgi/deathind.cgi

Hi Faysie, you can order Hugh's death certificate from the above link, just click on the Ref No and Print the form off, fill it in and post it.

I am booked into the Record Office today, you have to book in you cannot just turn up.  I see that Cider drinker has already done the look up for you, will see if there is anymore information available in the Parish Register. 

I think Dion is correct, Hugh and maybe Mary died before 1841 and the children are in the Gloucester Workhouse, there would not have been any or many Alexander Frazer's in 1841.  Gloucestershire could be where Hugh came from?  I would post on the Gloucester Forum see if anyone who knows the area well can find any Frazer's for you.  Will be in touch later today, from Linell.
Black Country Stringer, Sidaway, Mansell, Haynes, Westwood, Yardley, Reading, Worton, Willetts.

Offline Faysie

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Re: FRASER/FRAZER/FRAISER- Can you Help Please !!
« Reply #20 on: Thursday 13 September 12 07:41 BST (UK) »
Thanks Linell,

I am not familiar with the bookings etc over in England, so I appreciate you looking further for me even more. I will also look at the Gloucestrshire List and see what happens as you suggest.

I'm just so sorry that I lost all the websites that I had saved over the years, not only Staffordshire but also Essex and Lincolnshire where my lot came from... the "Fraser/Frazer" side is my hubby's and as he turns 84 years old next week I'm hoping that I can shed some more light on his Ancestors...

Looking forward to hearing from you.

Cheers for now

Faysie
Sach/Saich- Essex.
Kent & North Family - Hampshire.
Burke- Co Galway Ireland
Sharp/e- Sth Kyme-Pinchbeck & Blankney, Spalding- Lincolnshire, also Dorrington , Holland fen & Leicestershire.
Peck, Welbourn & Leadenha Lincolnshire
Plowright - Pinchbeck. Lincolnshire
Higman & Seldon Family- Stoke Damerol. Devon.
Freebody -Middlesex-London
Gravel- Prestwich. Manch-Lancashire
Fraser/Frazer- Salford  Manch Lancashire &  Staffordshire
Berry- Bollington. Cheshire
Micklethwaite -Stalybridge & Tintwhistl

Offline linell

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Re: FRASER/FRAZER/FRAISER- Can you Help Please !!
« Reply #21 on: Thursday 13 September 12 19:00 BST (UK) »
Hi Faysie, got a print out of your Marriage, if you PM me your address I will post it to you.  Details are much the same as Cider Drinker found.  I thought the date was the 26th of May 1831 at St Bartholomew Wednesbury, see what you think?

Also found the burial for Hugh:-
St Peter's Mear 16.10. 1837.  You can order his death certificate from the General Register Office.  Details as follows:-
Hugh Frazer Slymendale.  Aged 37. Entry 227.
Also William Frazer Slymendale Buried St Peter's Mear 19.9.1837 aged 16 months.  A month before his father, wonder if they both died of some nasty disease?

The baptism for Elizabeth, her surname could be either Ferguson or Frazer, difficult to read.  Baptised St Peter Norbury 6.10.1839 da of Hugh and Mary Ferguson or Frazer (she must have been illegitimate hence her baptism was at Norbury not at Mear or High Offley.)  The address was Sutton in the Parish of Forton - Father a Navigator (probably a Navi, may have worked laying the Train Lines which were being laid around that time?)

Baptism for Alexander Frazer St Mary High Offley 20.5.1832 son of Hugh and Mary Frazer High Offley Labourer.

If Hugh was working laying the Train Lines, this could explain why they were moving around.  I would think that Hugh must have previously lived in Gloucestershire as apparently the children were sent back there to be kept by the Parish in the Workhouse.  I would presume that Mary also died before 1841.

Anyway will leave this for you to take in, best wishes from Linell.

Black Country Stringer, Sidaway, Mansell, Haynes, Westwood, Yardley, Reading, Worton, Willetts.


Offline dionysus

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Re: FRASER/FRAZER/FRAISER- Can you Help Please !!
« Reply #22 on: Thursday 13 September 12 21:59 BST (UK) »
Nice work Linell.

The deaths of Hugh and two children so close together suggests some sort of illness or tragic accident.  Cause of death would be instructive.

I've found a few bits of jigsaw puzzle, but not sure how or whether they connect.

First, though, it is clear that Mary Frazer / Ferguson was widowed in 1837, just 4 weeks or so after losing 9 month old William.  But what of the Elizabeth Frazer or Ferguson baptised in 1839, Norbury? Thinking through the dates it seems inconceivable that Hugh was the father, but by naming him as the father perhaps Mary was protecting her integrity?

As Linell says, there must have been some connection to Dursley for the children to have been admitted to the workhouse there.  I think I am inching towards a connection.

A Mary Ferguson was baptised 14 Jul 1811 at Lydney, Glos.  This is just across the River Severn from Dursley, but may have seemed a long way at the time.  Her parents were Alexander and Elizabeth.

In the 1851 census there is a Sarah Ferguson, born Uley about 1816, married, visiting with William and Hester Robbins at Minchinhampton.  Uley is very near to Dursley.  These were Sarah's parents - baptism Sarah Robbins 18 Feb 1816 Uley.  Apparently, she married a man named Ferguson, in fact 19 Dec 1840 King's Stanley, Glos to James Ferguson.  A James Ferguson was living at Clifton in 1837 - today a suburb of Bristol.  There is a death of Mary Ferguson 1839 Oct Bristol 11 151.

So, is this the story?  Mary has a further child baptised in 1839.  Widowed, with a babe in arms and two other children, she is destitute and heads for relatives in Gloucestershire - James and Sarah Ferguson.  Sadly, Mary dies soon after and the children become the responsibility of James (Mary's brother?) and Sarah, who is unable or unwilling to care for them and places them in the workhouse.

This could be a classic example of the type of difficulty that beset familes who fell on hard times in mid-nineteenth century England.

Good hunting,
Dion
Upton, Bishops Wood, Staffordshire.  Jones, Nant-yr-Ych, Aberhafesp, Montgomeryshire.  Evans, Kinnerley, Flintshire.  Dennis, Breedon-on-the-Hill, Leicestershire.  Brown, Red Lake, Wellington, Shropshire.

Offline Faysie

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Re: FRASER/FRAZER/FRAISER- Can you Help Please !!
« Reply #23 on: Friday 14 September 12 03:14 BST (UK) »
Dear Linell, Cider & Dion,

This is the 3rd time that I have tried to reply this morning.. for some reason I cannot post so am trying once again.

Thank you Linell, you are a treasure... is it possible for you to scan the information to me? if not let me know and I will respond privately... my email address is (*) ... this is not my main private email address.

I will follow through with all the information that you allhave given to me. but there is one correction and that is... Elizabeth Ferguson Fraser was Baptised  26 November 1837 @ Maer.....

It seems so sad this family has had such tragedy..

Hope this post goes through..

Thanks you all again..

Faysie

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Sach/Saich- Essex.
Kent & North Family - Hampshire.
Burke- Co Galway Ireland
Sharp/e- Sth Kyme-Pinchbeck & Blankney, Spalding- Lincolnshire, also Dorrington , Holland fen & Leicestershire.
Peck, Welbourn & Leadenha Lincolnshire
Plowright - Pinchbeck. Lincolnshire
Higman & Seldon Family- Stoke Damerol. Devon.
Freebody -Middlesex-London
Gravel- Prestwich. Manch-Lancashire
Fraser/Frazer- Salford  Manch Lancashire &  Staffordshire
Berry- Bollington. Cheshire
Micklethwaite -Stalybridge & Tintwhistl

Offline dionysus

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Re: FRASER/FRAZER/FRAISER- Can you Help Please !!
« Reply #24 on: Friday 14 September 12 07:21 BST (UK) »
Nice work Linell.

Hello Faysie - I also had problems posting earlier.  There were two Elizabeths.  Elizabeth Ferguson Frazer bp 1837, died 1837 and Elizabeth bp 6 Oct 1839, Norbury (apparently half-sister to Alexander and Anne).  It was fairly common practice to re-use names of deceased children.

The deaths of Hugh and two children so close together suggests some sort of illness or tragic accident.  Cause of death would be instructive.

I've found a few bits of jigsaw puzzle, but not sure how or whether they connect.

First, though, it is clear that Mary Frazer / Ferguson was widowed in 1837, just a few weeks or days after losing two children.  But what of the Elizabeth Frazer or Ferguson baptised in 1839, Norbury? Thinking through the dates it seems inconceivable that Hugh was the father, but by naming him as such Mary may have been protecting her integrity.

As Linell says, there must have been some connection to Dursley for the children to have been admitted to the workhouse there.  I think I am inching towards a connection.

A Mary Ferguson was baptised 14 Jul 1811 at Lydney, Glos.  This is just across the River Severn from Dursley, but may have seemed a long way at the time.  Her parents were Alexander and Elizabeth.

In the 1851 census there is a Sarah Ferguson, born Uley about 1816, married, visiting with William and Hester Robbins at Minchinhampton.  Uley is very near to Dursley.  These were Sarah's parents - baptism Sarah Robbins 18 Feb 1816 Uley.  Apparently, she married a man named Ferguson, in fact 19 Dec 1840 King's Stanley, Glos to James Ferguson.  A James Ferguson was living at Clifton in 1837 - today a suburb of Bristol.  There is a death of Mary Ferguson 1839 Oct Bristol 11 151.

So, is this the story?  Mary has a further child baptised in 1839.  Widowed, with a babe in arms and two other children, she is destitute and heads for relatives in Gloucestershire - James and Sarah Ferguson.  Sadly, Mary dies soon after and the children become the responsibility of James (Mary's brother?) and Sarah, who are unable or unwilling to care for them and place them in the workhouse.  There had been a workhouse at Uley, but this closed when Dursley opened in 1839.

This could be a classic example of the difficulty that beset familes who fell on hard times in mid-nineteenth century England.

Good hunting,
Dion
Upton, Bishops Wood, Staffordshire.  Jones, Nant-yr-Ych, Aberhafesp, Montgomeryshire.  Evans, Kinnerley, Flintshire.  Dennis, Breedon-on-the-Hill, Leicestershire.  Brown, Red Lake, Wellington, Shropshire.

Offline linell

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Re: FRASER/FRAZER/FRAISER- Can you Help Please !!
« Reply #25 on: Friday 14 September 12 08:42 BST (UK) »
Hi Faysie, yes will scan the Print Out and send it to you.  What a tragic family, would love to know what they all died of maybe Cholera or the like?   I would get in touch with Gloucester County Record Office and see if there are any records on Dursley Workhouse.  I would also order as many of the death certificates you can too.

That's brilliant Dion, so it was probably the Ferguson's who were from Gloucester, the find of a baptism for Mary Ferguson to an Alexander and Elizabeth, I am a great believer in family names, especially as the Elizabeth was used twice.  Think you have a very good find there. 

This is a very interesting line of research, Norbury and High Offley are not far from me, will have to go and have a look.  Norbury is a large Canal Junction, which is another possible line of research, I know that a lot of Gloucester families came to the Midlands up the Canal Network.

Great to see all of this coming together. 

Linell.

Black Country Stringer, Sidaway, Mansell, Haynes, Westwood, Yardley, Reading, Worton, Willetts.

Offline linell

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Re: FRASER/FRAZER/FRAISER- Can you Help Please !!
« Reply #26 on: Friday 14 September 12 08:44 BST (UK) »
Just a thought if we are going down the line of family names, wonder if Hugh's father was a William Frazer??

Linell.
Black Country Stringer, Sidaway, Mansell, Haynes, Westwood, Yardley, Reading, Worton, Willetts.