Owen of Llanwyddelan

[ROBERTOWEN]

I have traced my gggf ,John Owen back to Llanwyddelan, were his Son, John Richard married Elizabeth Gittins of Penygelli, in 1863
In 1861 he's in Liverpool, his Son was born in Liverpool in 1842.
So he left the village to make his fortune in Liverpool. married a Jane ?, from Anglesey.
Where was he in Llanwyddelan?
Records are a 'bit thin on the ground' now, any ideas.

[Lloydy]

Hi Robert

I know I've looked up a few of your rellies for you before - can't remember if I have had a look for the Owen's for you. 

When and where was John Owen (Senior) born? and the same for John Richard?

I have just had a look through the parish of Llanwyddelan in the 1851 Montgomeryshire census and there are also several Gittins listed.  Have I already let you have this info? 

I've got a terrible memory - let me know!!

Jan

[ROBERTOWEN]

Hi Jan
Having great difficulty in tracing John Owen before 1861.
He married Jane Owen from Anglesey (still waiting for a possible certificate)
From the 1861 censusit looks like he might be from Llanwyddelan, (the writing isn't very clear)which would account for his Son to have met the Elizabeth Gittins of Penygelli.
A contact at the FHS found coincidently, a John Owen and Jane Owen, and a son, John, in Llanwyddelan in 1841. The ages aren't quite right,a couple of years out,  and John Richard the son was born in Liverpool, Although I have yet to find a Birth Certificate, despite many tries.
Do you think they would have travelled between Liverpool and Llanwyddelan regularly?
Would you be kind enough to look for that family in the 1851 Census of Llanwyddelan .

Rob

[Lloydy]

Hi Rob

Instead of doing a general search of 1851 I have looked through the parish of Llanwyddelan and found the following OWEN:-

Living at Freethwrn

Thomas Owen 59, Farmer born Llanwyddelan and Wife Elizabeth 61 born Bettws.

I('ve put these just in case there's a connection!)

The only other OWEN listed is a John Owen 70 year old unmarried pauper!!  Not one of yours, I think!

Could you just confirm John Owen (senior) year of birth so I can just check some others listed.

In response to your question regarding them travelling between Liverpool and Llanwyddeln I suppose anything could have been possible.  I honestly don't know!!  Perhaps you could post that query in The Common Room Board - I'm sure someone will know there.

Jan

[ROBERTOWEN]

Hi
Thanks for the look up,
according to the 1861 Census in Liverpool , he was 52 yrs, which makes it about 1809.
I still wonder if the John & Jane Owen of the 1841 aren't the same people.Although the Birth date would be  1816 !!
Have you found them in 1851?

Regards
Rob

[Lloydy]

Hi Rob

Do you think this could be them?!!

HO107/2495, folio 462, page 6

Living at Nantyreskirwen, Llanbrynmair (comes under the Machynlleth Enumeration District)

John Owen Head age 46, Farmer of 60 acres born MGY Llanwyddelan
Jane Owen Wife age 48 born MGY Llanbrynmair

The only thing that puzzles me is Jane's place of birth   What proof do you have which shows she was born in Anglesey?

I do hope these are yours!!  Only by chance did I have a look at the Machynlleth district!!

Jan

[ROBERTOWEN]

 :(No I don't think so.. Her birthplace is in the 1861 census.

Back to the drawing-board.

Rob

[Lloydy]

Rob

Is her birthplace shown as Anglesey on more than one census?  The only reason I ask is that a lot of my ancestors places of births change on a lot of the census returns.

And, another thing to consider would be that the birthplace on the 1851 census is incorrect.  Perhaps the enumerator made a mistake by writing her place of birth as the parish in which she was living.  Just a thought.........

Let me know if I can be of any further help.

Jan