Author Topic: Dutch location question  (Read 1494 times)

Offline MattH

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Dutch location question
« on: Sunday 17 June 12 22:02 BST (UK) »
Hello,
I am in need of some help identifying a particular location that is found on a marriage record (gaardersregister) for a couple of my Dutch ancestors. The record is between a Filip Horstman and Lijsbet Klaas Spruitenburg. I have identified the part that I need help with by placing an blank in the spot. Information that clarifies the record are in brackets. I have also attached the record for you to see/read.

"den 25 dito [November 1746]
Heeft Filip Horstman jongman van Brandenburgh ____ woonende alhier met Lijsbet Klaas Spruitenburg geboortig en woonende alhier [Langeraar] hebben beijde verklaart te gehooren onder 't Classis van.... Prodeo"

I need help also identifying the location of Brandenburgh. On the marriage registration (another document I've attached) it is listed as Brandenburg with no 'h'.

Any help that will give me an idea as to the word and village in question will certainly be of great help to me. Thanks!

Offline choppies

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Re: Dutch location question
« Reply #1 on: Monday 18 June 12 00:07 BST (UK) »
I suspect it's Brandenburg in Germany.  I have a few Dutch/German marriages amongst my ancestors and it's only ever the city name that is mentioned and the country is unspecified.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brandenburg 

Offline MattH

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Re: Dutch location question
« Reply #2 on: Monday 18 June 12 00:42 BST (UK) »
Thanks for the help. I, too, thought it was the Brandenburg in Germany. I'm still not too positive that it is, however. I had a look at a couple of gazetteers, one from 1794 written in English and another from 1840 written in Dutch. Just for reference, the marriage took place in 1746. (I haven't been able to find a gazetteer from an earlier period, but that doesn't mean that they don't exist.)
The 1794 version, which is a gazetteer of the Netherlands, has two entries for Brandenburg: (1) a village in the province of Limbourg 20 leagues south from Aix-la-Chappelle [nowadays known as Aachen in Germany]; and (2) a town of Luxenbourg.
The 1840 version is a general gazetteer. It also has two entries: (1) a town in Luxembourg; and (2) a former town in the province of Groningen.
I may be able to lean towards what you said, but I have noticed that whenever a person is from a different location, they typically list the province (if in the Netherlands), or the county (if outside of the county). If what you say is true, then Brandenburg, Germany is the first exception I've seen.
Perhaps I should contact a Dutch historical geographer to see if maybe a Brandenburg was a town that is now non-existent. Any suggestions?

Offline choppies

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Re: Dutch location question
« Reply #3 on: Monday 18 June 12 01:00 BST (UK) »
I can't help I'm afraid.  You've clearly done far more research into this than I have.  I have noticed with my ancestors' marriage records though that the country is never listed and has caused some confusion until I have found further records confirming German origins.


Offline MattH

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Re: Dutch location question
« Reply #4 on: Monday 18 June 12 01:03 BST (UK) »
You know, you do bring up a good point: Germany wasn't a unified country until 1871. I completely overlooked that aspect. You may be absolutely correct about this one then. I'll have to do a bit more research, I guess.

Offline MattH

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Re: Dutch location question
« Reply #5 on: Monday 18 June 12 13:32 BST (UK) »
Just a brief update here:I e-mailed a historical geographer who explained to me that in the 17th and 18th centuries many laborers from northern Germany migrated to the western part of the Netherlands. He theorized that he feels strongly that the Brandenburg in question is the Brandenburg in the former Prussia (now Germany). He also explained that Horstman is without a doubt a Germanic surname. With this information, I'm more able to safely say that the Brandenburg here is THE Brandenburg in present-day Germany.
By the way, the missing word I was looking for was the word dog, but in today's spelling it would be doch as in the English word "however."
Thanks again for your help and ideas.