Irish Land Commission Archives

[muckjack]

Has anyone been able to use these archives? They're held in the national archives, but catalogued in the National Library.

The inspectors reports on individual tenant holdings could be interesting, but reading an article from a few years ago it says the records are virtually inaccessible. I'm wondering has the situation changed since then, does anyone have any experience of using them?

[aghadowey]

If no one here can answer your question you could contact both institutions for clarification.

[CBGenealogy]

I believe that they have been removed from the National Archives building to storage.

I've never heard of anyone getting access to them.  According to a professional I know, the records are uncatalogued and access to them is usually denied on grounds that they are still contentious (which probably bureaucrat speak for "we couldn't be bothered properly cataloguing them and don't have the staff and resources anyway).

[Sonas]

The address for the Records Branch of the Irish Land Commission as given on the Dept of Agriculture website is an industrial estate in Portlaoise. While the Records Branch was in the National Archives building, it was not technically part of the National Archives.

Have you got a reference for your information about the NLI cataloguing them Muckjack? I don't know why this would be done. If you can't get access to the Land Commission material, a possible way around it, if you are interested in a particular tenant is to see if the papers of the relevant landed estate are available as there is often Land Commmission material there.

I have heard of people getting access but have no idea how common/uncommon this is. Not being catalogued is actually a more defensible reason than contentiousness for denial of access I think given that some of this material is old at this stage!

[annclare]

I understand the records have been removed to a storage facility ( I forget where but somewhere in the Midlands). About six years ago I got permission to look at the records for an estate I was researching for a local history project.- but I first had to get written permission from a present day descendant before doing so. And I was not allowed to look at the Inspectors reports. The Land Commision is almost paranoid about these records as they can give a lot of personal details and as land was always a controversial issue it seems they are concerned releasing them could re-ignite old grudges!!!
Seem not to recognise what century we are in.!! It says it regards the records as the personal property of the former owners of the estates or the landowners. However  there is a body of opinion that holds these records should be seen as public records and should fall within the remit of the National Archives. If you want to know where the storage facility is I can find out and let you know in a couple of days.
annclare
PS Some of the records are catalogued by the National Library - that is how I found out about the estate I was interested in.

[Sonas]

I understand the records have been removed to a storage facility ( I forget where but somewhere in the Midlands). About six years ago I got permission to look at the records for an estate I was researching for a local history project.- but I first had to get written permission from a present day descendant before doing so. And I was not allowed to look at the Inspectors reports. The Land Commision is almost paranoid about these records as they can give a lot of personal details and as land was always a controversial issue it seems they are concerned releasing them could re-ignite old grudges!!!
Seem not to recognise what century we are in.!! It says it regards the records as the personal property of the former owners of the estates or the landowners. However  there is a body of opinion that holds these records should be seen as public records and should fall within the remit of the National Archives. If you want to know where the storage facility is I can find out and let you know in a couple of days.
annclare
PS Some of the records are catalogued by the National Library - that is how I found out about the estate I was interested in.

Land Commission records are public records as far as I can tell. They are listed in the National Archives Act.

Is there a catalogue somewhere on the NLI site for the records they catalogued? I did have a look but can't see anything.

I'm going to give the Land Commission a call tomorrow and see what they say. My family owned (edit: should say occupied really) a piece of land which there was various types of trouble about for decades. By the time it was taken from them in the 1960s it was in the hands of extended family. I would love to know what exactly the story was but I don't suppose I have a hope of getting access to material this recent.

[leprechaun]

Land Commission Records.
Under the provisions of the Land Purchase Acts,which subsidised the purchase
of small holdings by tenant occupiers,it was necessary for those wishing to sell their land to produce evidence of ownership to the Irish Land Commission.
As a result,over 10,000 wills were deposited with the Land Commission the majority dating from the nineteenth century but many earlier still.
The N.L.I. and PRONI hold card index to the testators ,but the original documents remain unavailable to the public.They are housed in the office of the Land Commission on the ground floor of the N.L.I.
                                      Lep:

[muckjack]

Thanks for the replies everyone!

Sonas I got my information from "Sources for the History of Landed Estates in Ireland" Terence Dooley 2000. There's a card index file in the reading room in the NLI arranged by county and estate name. This will have two references. "E.C.1234" refers you to green volumes in the reading room. "box no.1234" refers to the Land Commission reference. The green volumes contain information on the contents of the boxes. Let us know how you get on calling them!

I know there are no estates records existing for the one I'm interested in. I even contacted a descendent of that estate to see if there were any held privately.

I think the inspectors reports that deal with the tenants could be a great source. For those of us with farming forebears I feel like it would be akin to military records of ancestors in the military. I'm sure eventually they could introduce some form of service where you could pay to view the records, similar to the valuation books, this would help support the resources needed.

As for the sensitivity of material issue, considering what you can already access, I can't see it being an issue, just an excuse. The people who decided to send them down to storage in Portlaoise are probably descendents of the people who decided to burn the 1800's censuses