Author Topic: Samuel Hewett BATE-Mary Jane MANNING  (Read 3478 times)

Offline JOHNYP

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Samuel Hewett BATE-Mary Jane MANNING
« on: Tuesday 24 April 12 10:30 BST (UK) »
Hello
I have a Samuel Hewett Bate born 1841 St Austell Cornwall, Son of John Bate 1801 - 1874 and Ann Hoal Crapp 1814 - 1879. I Have that he Married Mary Jane Manning Born Dittisham 1850 Married at Totnes Devon  in 1871. I have them on the 1881 Census Living in Barnstable with 3 children.
Samuel Hewett Bate was the H M Post Master (Civil Service) and the family moved to London where I have the 3 children all Dying young between 13 to 27 years of age in West Ham.
I managed to find a Mary Manning on the 1861 census giving her parents  as John and Grace living in Ashprington Devon, But now believe this could be wrong.

Anybody with any information about Mary Jane Manning, who her Parents are and any other family members. That could put me back on right road would be a great help.
Thanks John

Offline PaulineJ

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Re: Samuel Hewett Bate-Mary Jane Manning
« Reply #1 on: Tuesday 24 April 12 10:36 BST (UK) »
So the 1871 marriage was in the totnes reg. district , rather than totnes itself. Oct-Nov-Dec Qtr.

What is in her 'name of father' box and what names witness?

I see he left a will, his death 12/mar/1883.

Pauline
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Offline PaulineJ

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Re: Samuel Hewett Bate-Mary Jane Manning
« Reply #2 on: Tuesday 24 April 12 10:42 BST (UK) »
What makes you think the john & grace parents for Mary Jane are wrong?

1871 reference RG10/2094; Folio: 17, page 1
1861 reference RG 9/1417; Folio: 14; Page: 2
1851 reference HO107/1873; Folio: 533; Page: 10 (Father is William here)

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Offline DOB7

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Re: Samuel Hewett Bate-Mary Jane Manning
« Reply #3 on: Tuesday 24 April 12 10:51 BST (UK) »
The 1871 census shows:
Chudleigh NEWTON ABBOT, Devonshire RG10 piece 2075 folio 76 page 26
Catherine MANNING Head Widow 78 Ag Lab Widow b Chudleigh
Mary Jane MANNING Gdau Single 21 Domestic Servant b Chudleigh
Eliza MANNING Gdau 10 Scholar b Chudleigh
I was able to find this Mary Jane in 1851 with her parents John (Ag Lab) & Elizabeth, living in Chudleigh.
The 1861 census that you have does seem likely - Mary Jane's birthplace is Dittisham and the date seems correct. I would recommend obtaining Samuel's marriage certificate to Mary Jane - it will give fathers' names & occupations and address at time of marriage.
Squance, Lillicrap, Dankester, Surtees, Yates


Offline JOHNYP

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Re: Samuel Hewett Bate-Mary Jane Manning
« Reply #4 on: Tuesday 24 April 12 11:36 BST (UK) »
Hello Pauline
The reason i have any doubt about her parents are that I looked on a site called Mundia that is run by Ancestry.com. This site allows you to look at other Family trees to compare. On Mundia all the other family trees I have looked at have Johns brother William born 1817 Ashprington and Grace Jollow as the parents for the same children as is in the 1861 census that clearly says that the head of the family is John with his wife Grace. They also have Mary Jane Manning Married to William Pridham (1846 St Germans) Married 1870 in Plymouth.
This stared me thinking that either i am wrong or all the others are, I know this is only what other people have in there family trees but it helps sometimes with cross referencing.
It seems there are at least two Mary Jane Manning's both born about the same time, and Married about the same time.
Anyway thanks for your help.
John

Offline PaulineJ

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Re: Samuel Hewett Bate-Mary Jane Manning
« Reply #5 on: Tuesday 24 April 12 11:55 BST (UK) »
It only takes one mistake and the others to copy without verification.

Mary jane, with mother Grace shows as unwed in 1871. So she's unlikley to be the 1870 bride.
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Offline DOB7

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Re: Samuel Hewett Bate-Mary Jane Manning
« Reply #6 on: Tuesday 24 April 12 12:26 BST (UK) »
The Mary Jane MANNING who married William PRIDHAM in 1870 was shown in the 1871 census, married, aged 20, born Plymouth, living with her husband and his parents in Plymouth. RG10 piece 2114 folio 76 page 35
Squance, Lillicrap, Dankester, Surtees, Yates

Offline Dave Jones

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Re: Samuel Hewett Bate-Mary Jane Manning
« Reply #7 on: Tuesday 24 April 12 13:39 BST (UK) »
Western Times 17th October 1871
Marriages
Bate – Manning. Oct 12, at Ashprington by Totnes, Mr S.H Bate, of Plymouth, to Miss J Manning of Washbourne Barton, Ashprington

Western Times 20th October 1871
Marriages
Bate-Manning. Oct 12, at Ashprington, by the Rev. G.T Carwithen, Mr Samuel Hewitt Bate, of the Post-office, Plymouth, eldest son of John Bate, Esq., of Fowey, Cornwall, to Jane, third daughter of the late Mr William Manning, of Washbourne Barton.

Exeter & Plymouth Gazette 20th October 1871
Marriages
Bate – Manning Oct 12, at Ashprington, Mr Samuel Hewett Bate, of Plymouth, to Miss M J Manning, of Washbourne Barton, Ashprington.

Royal Cornwall Gazette 16th March 1883
Deaths
Bate – At 3, RockPark-terrace, Barnstaple, March 12, Samuel Hewett Bate, postmaster, formerly of Fowey, aged 41.

North Devon Journal 8th May 1884
Marriages
Heraud – Bate. At St Lukes, Plymouth, by the Rev I Hawker, Claudius W Heraud, of Essex, to Janie, widow of Samuel Hewett Bate, late postmaster of Barnstaple.

National Probate Calendar 1896
Heraud – Mary Jane of Washbourne Grove-hill, Woodford, Essex, (wife of Claudius William Heraud) died 4th April 1896. Probate to Claudius William Heraud and Sydney Bate, gentlemen.


Offline Dave Jones

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Re: Samuel Hewett Bate-Mary Jane Manning
« Reply #8 on: Tuesday 24 April 12 17:33 BST (UK) »
The simple answer would appear to be that William Manning died and his widow Grace (nee Cutmore) then married John Manning.

In 1851 Census William & Grace Manning and their children were at Bozom Zeal Barton, Dittisham

Western Times 29th July 1854
Deaths
July 26, at Bozom Zeal Barton, Dittisham, Mr William Manning, yeoman, aged 37.

FreeBMD have John Manning and Grace Manning on same page of weddings registered at Plymouth quarter to December 1857

In 1861 Census John & Grace Manning are at Washbourne, Ashprington
With them are all the children shown in 1851 as bring children of William & Grace Manning.
Amongst the “new” children is Mary Jane Manning aged 9 which would make her birth before both the death of William and the marriage of John and Grace