Mary or Anna Maria

[Colur]

I only became interested in my Family Tree when the 1911 Census came on line and I discovered that my Great Grandparents, James Comiskey and Mary Anne Merryman were both still alive and living at Valetta Avenue Kingstown on the night.
Their return also showed that they had ten children all of whom were still alive.
My first task was to locate those ten children. I quickly discovered through Internet searches that, at least three others more than twenty years ago had already done Trojan work in this regard including a One Name Study which went back five generations.
For some reason all three returned only nine children merging Mary and Anna Maria, both of whom are shown at the Valetta Avenue address, Mary as a single girl and Anna Maria Cavanagh (mis-transcribed) as a married woman with her husband Francis Kavanagh and two children Joseph and Mary.
Before the 1901 Census came on line I accessed it through the Dun Laoghaire Library and again both Mary and Anna Maria, as a single girl, were returned from the Valetta address
Mary remained single and I was able to trace her through electoral registers until her death in 1968 when she was interred in the family grave with her parents and eldest sister Elizabeth who also did not marry.

The One Name Study lists the following for Mary:
D O B 13th July 1873 Confirmed as D O B for Anna Maria as per Familysearch
Marriage 25th February 1904 St. Michael's Kingstown to Francis Kavanagh but Anna Maria is shown as the wife of Francis Kavanagh on the 1911 Census, they being married seven years and have two children Joseph (6) Born Dublin City and Mary (1) Born Co Dublin.
D O D 2nd October 1968 which is the date on the headstone for Mary in Deansgrange.
The O N S does not reference Anna Maria at all; the other two do but return her as     Mary /Anna Maria with all the above dates.
I think the problem for the earlier researchers was caused by there being no apparent birth record for Mary as oral history had my G/Grandparents and their first child John (1867) migrating down the west of the County from Lucan and cutting across through Dundrum where my Grandfather Michael was Christened (1868), through Rathfarnham etc before arriving in Glasthule where their third child Elizabeth was Christened in 1870 so any search for  children would have been out in the 'county' but I have found a birth on Irishgenealogy and Familysearch for a Mary / Female born in 1869 to James Comiskey and Mary Anne Merriman (returned as MerriGan on the Church records but both the sponsors were MerriMan) Their address was returned as Cumberland Street which is City centre
I would really appreciate any help or advice on this as it is one of those walls that just wont come down.
Many Thanks,
John       

[ourgang]

there is a Cumberland Street in DunLaoghaire then called Kingstown. My great grandparents were from Cumberland St.

[shanew147]

I'd say that baptism relates to a Cumberland street in the city - the parish is St. Andrew's RC, Westland Row. see : link

There were/are two Cumberland Streets - a North near Marlborough Street, and a South off Great Brunswick Street, later Pearse Street - which is right beside Westland Row.


Shane

[shanew147]

following the baptisms and extracted records here's the timeline/locations that I see..

  John - 1867, Esker, Clondalkin RC
  [male] - 23 Mar 1868, Dublin North City
  Mary - 13 Aug 1869, Cumberland Street, St. Andrews RC*
  Anna Maria - Jul 1873, (possibly Dublin north ?)
  Thomas, 14 Feb 1875, Rathdown registration district #
  Agnes - 24 Apr 1876,  Rathdown registration district
  James - 23 Oct 1878, Kingstown

* Civil record shows place of registration as Dublin North City
# Rathdown district covers south east Co. Dublin and includes Dún Laoghaire/Kingstown, Dundrum etc


Shane

[shanew147]

I dont see a matching Index record or baptism for Anna Maria in 1873. Closest match is a [female] Comisley birth registration in Dublin north - but the extracted record should match the details, and show no first name..

Also a little strange that the extracted birth has a Month and year, but no day


Shane

[Colur]

Hi ourgang and thanks for coming back so quickly. Although some of James and Mary Anne’s younger children were born in Cumberland Street Kingstown I had ruled it out for Mary because of the points raised by Shane.
Well done on the seven Shane, the three missing are Elizabeth, Martha and Bridget.
The notes that were passed on to me show that Elizabeth was christened in St Josephs Church Glasthule. I could not find any reference to her birth in the Familysearch lists. She is returned on both Census’ as a domestic from different addresses in the immediate area but there is no further information about her until I read the inscription on the headstone on her parent’s grave showing her death in 1940.
Again, working off the O N S both Martha and Bridget were baptised in St Michaels Church Kingstown in 1881 and 1883 respectively, and there are returns on the Familysearch which would tie in with these dates.  Both these births were registered in Rathdown.
 Thanks to the great advice given freely on this Board, I have proven Mary and Anna Marie are two different people. The icing on the cake would be to find some proof of who exactly married Francis Kavanagh in 1904. The marriage details issued by the church, I am told, clearly show Mary as being (the name of) the  bride but if Anna Maria was known only as Maria it might have been misread and transcribed as was the case in the  example given above of MerriMAN and MerriGAN. I am also told that the St Michael’s Church Register is not available to the general public so the mistake (if there is one) might never be rectified on any subsequent certs.
Thanks once again.
John

Shane, just noticed your last reply. One set of notes gives a date of 13th July 1873 and the baptism to have taken place in St Josephs Glasthule also.
John

[eadaoin]

I've looked at St Michael's register Kingstown in the National Library - I think it goes up to 1930 ...

as far as I can remember, it wasn't available until 8? 10? years ago ...

eadaoin

[shanew147]

Records for St. Michael's Kingstown/Dún Laoghaire are included on the NLI microfilm list - Pos. 9071, 9072 and 9073. Baptisms are covered from 1768 to 1914, and and marriages from 1769 to 1932



Shane

[hasta]

Colur
It seems very clear that Anna Maria and Mary are two people and poor Anna Maria has been erased from history.
If those other people did their research so long ago, without the census, then you can see how the confusion arose when they saw that church marriage record saying 'Mary'

All easily rectified by getting a copy of the Civil record of the 1904 marriage for Francis/Anna Maria ......... and having said that I have just spent an half an hour looking for it and have turned up nothing even likely !!     Have you found that ?