Thomas Lyson Mayor of Oldham 1957-8

[Mooncoin]

Wow I am getting confused now,

Thomas Lysons father is Joshua Lyson. If Thomas is born 1900-1905 say, then Joshua needs to be born within !870-1876.

Betty Young's eldest son Joshua is born 1871 so the dates are OK for that , it's just the name , he is Joshua Young , but given that alot of these 1st children were born out of wedlock he could be born Joshua Lyson but that needs to be proved.

I am not on my computer at home at the moment but I have evidence that Betty Lysons marries John Young. The other Betty continues with the name Atherton. it doesn't say Betty Atherton marries John Young.

This is hard

[Mooncoin]

This is the Trevor Jones 44 on Ancestry. It's wrong. I have contacted this lady and she is of the Coward family , she has all of my grandfathers brothers down on her chart but it isn't right and I have contacted her via Ancestry.

John Young did not marry Mary Prescott, not in my family anyway. My mother at 81 still has recall.

[millymcb]

I am not looking at the Coward tree - and other than looking at original certificates - I take many online trees with a pinch of salt


I am sure that your mother is quite right that John Young didn't marry Mary Prescott

I am saying that Mary Prescott married 1) Joshua Lyons in 1846 and 2) James Atherton in 1850
and that she is the mother of Betty Lysons born 1848.


Betty Lysons/License then marries John Young in 1872 (after having Joshua Lysons in 1870)


It would be interesting to see what info you have about this marriage when you get back to your computer..

 
Milly


Betty Lysons birth
DecQ 1848  Wigan 21 738

Joshua Lysons birth
Decq 1870 Wigan 8c 77

Betty Lysons (License) and John Young Marriage
Jun Q 1872 Wigan    8c   26

[carol8353]

Ahaha I can see that much clearer now- so on the 1911 census Joshua has taken on his 'step' fathers name,despite being born a Lyson before his mum married two years later. Until you get the actual cert ,we wont know if John Young was his natural father though unless you get the birth cert.

It may turn out that she didn't actually name the real father though.

Carol

[Mooncoin]

I have it now John Young (1846-1894) married Betty Lysons at
Hindley All Saints 15th April 1872.

You were right Milly B.

Was Joshua her first son named Lysons or Young? If he was a Lysons then he is the father of Thomas Mayor of Oldham. I think from Ancestry there was a John and a James older brothers to Thomas. Aaaah that would make sense.

[carol8353]

Betty Lysons birth
DecQ 1848  Wigan 21 738

Joshua Lysons birth
Decq 1870 Wigan 8c 77

Betty Lysons (License) and John Young Marriage
Jun Q 1872 Wigan    8c   26

Mooncoin,

You will see from these dates that Milly found for you that Joshua was born in 1870 before his mum married in 1872 so was a Lyson......she later married John Young and I imagine to make things simpler all round Joshua took on his 'step' dad's(and mum's new) surname.

Unless of course John Young WAS actually his natural dad?
He may well have adopted him and so he became a Young that way.

Carol

[Mooncoin]

There is a marriage 1872 Wigan Betty License  do you think that is a phonetic mistake?
Someone misheard Lysons and wrote License.

[millymcb]

What is the marriage you have for Betty and John? I can see one for a John Young and Betty LICENCE at All Saints, Hindley in 1872. (on LancsBMD)

15 Apr 1872 All Saints, Hindley, Lancashire, England
John Young - Bachelor - age 24
Occ: Fireman
Res:L Hindley Common
Father: David Young, Labourer (Deceased)

Betty License - spinster - age 23
Res: Hindley Common 
Father: Joshua License, Collier

Witnesses: George Prescott and Betty Prescott
 
and FreeBMD ref
Jun 1872  Wigan    8c   26


Milly

Yes - that is the one I think is correct. I would say almost certainly a mis-hearing of the name...   
I think the tea-pot must be a later gift

Milly

[millymcb]

And you will see her father's name is Joshua - which is the name she gave her first born son

And witness is George Prescott - who I think is her older brother as seen in the 1851 Census (with the Athertons)


John Young occupation is fireman. (I think this may be as in keeping fire going in a mill or coal mine rather than what we think of as a fireman today)


Milly