**COMPLETED** Bertha GLOVER born 1833 Wittersham, Kent arrived Sydney 1837

[Caryn_1]

Hi All

Sorry haven’t been online for a couple of days all. Been most unwell. Well, well haven’t you been industrious.

Muss - Bertha Gorham married Thomas Tandy 1850 no 351  married NEW ZEALAND – that was a find and half I must say. Very well done! I must say, I didn't even think to look outside of Australia. I didn't the family went there. Now you've got me wondering....why?

The fellow you’ve referred to majm, who died in Walgett in 1883, was Theodore Glover, Bertha’s youngest brother. Born 1839 and died 1883. I have his death certificate confirming his parents. Most certainly not Bertha’s child.  Good grief, she would have been an insanely young mum...............

Muss – you are quite correct – George Glover did die in 1869 – 26 June 1869 in Morpeth. I have photos of his grave where he is buried with two of his grandchildren. Re: the Mr & Mrs Glover travelling from NZ with 4 sons and 5 daughters – no idea who they might be as George and Amelia only ever had 1 daughter and 3 sons that I have ever known of.

The 1855 court case re: daughter Emily – never been quite able to prove if Harriet Grace Champion and Herriot Champion were one and the same person. I've assumed they were, but not quite sure. No doubt this George and Harriot/Herriot had a daughter Emily. Not a particularly pleasant case either. And I don't have the names of the other children.

No I don’t have George Glover’s death certificate as yet. It’s yet another document I’m waiting for that is still on the way, as is Amelia’s (it is believed she died in 1839 – father’s name Henry).

Merlin – thank you for your input and info, that’s fabulous.

Neil – I’m extremely jealous you get to walk through the Morpeth cemetery so often. So many of my ancestors are buried there! There and Maitland.

And now for the news on Bertha’s death certificate – drum roll – the informant of her death on 27 July 1913 was her son Alfred Stephen King. The ONLY children listed on the death certificate are Alfred Stephen King, Elizabeth Jane (my 2xgreat grandmother) King and James King. Absolutely no other children from any other marriage are listed.

The marriages to Stephen King and Charles Coxhead are listed. No marriage to a Mr Tandy is listed. Bertha’s father is listed as George Glover, with mother’s maiden name as Goram. It confirms her age indicating she was born in 1833.

That Mr Tandy’s name does not appear on the death certificate – to my mind- indicates that none of her children knew she was previously married. If they did know and they were aware that children existed, then why not mention them on the death certificate?

The death certificate also confirms that the Madeline King born in 1863 is not one of Bertha’s children as I had previously thought, and it indicates that there are no children deceased.

Oh and a little sideline – the death certificate for one Sarah Bertha King born in Morpeth in 1869 – whose mother was a Bertha King – also indicates that her father was a Henry Blundell and not Stephen King. I had a feeling she didn’t belong to my Bertha, but ordered her birth certificate anyway just to be sure.

You guys are great! Thank you so much for your efforts at solving the Bertha first marriage mystery!

Now to solve the other little mysteries that have appeared as a result....

Cheers
Caryn

[Caryn_1]

Hi All

Geez - I just realised with Theodore Glover died 1883 - no mother's maiden name is recorded on the death certificate..... just as well you can't swear on here. Now I'm wondering if Theodore doesn't belong and there was only one daughter and two sons. D'oh!!!!

Cheers
Caryn

[Caryn_1]

Also meant to add that I don't know where George Glover was working when he first arrived into Sydney, however at the time of his death, the Coroners report indicated he was working for a Mr Apps. George died while driving a dray and team of two horses from Morpeth to West Maitland. He was drunk, fell off and rolled under the dray. Seems one of the wheels rolled over his shoulders. Reading what is in trove, seems George in his seemingly very drunken state wasn't going to be deterred from leaving Morpeth even though a few people tried to stop him.

Cheers
Caryn

[muss]

Hi Caryn


I think George and Herriot/ Harriet went to NZ not George and Amelia

Emily may have married Andrew Brown 1862  and died 1878 Sydney

I  have not  looked for any of the other children ( who I think may have been
born in NZ)

Glad to help

Muss

[majm]

Thanks for the info from her dc...  I see that Alfred had no knowledge of Thomas George ..  Bertha's first born ...  I wonder if Harriet Grace raised him ...   

I would treat Herriot and Harriet/ett/ot/ott as one and the same ...  If I don't then  my Harriet/tt/ott would be 3 different people all giving birth to just the ONE baby ... In NSW in the 1850s .. And that would conflict with official NSW Probate Packet evidence as well as photographic evidence and and newspaper cuttings and other NSW BDM civil rgistrations including my Harriet's dc.   

Those ECRs were based on handwritten PRs and the spelling depends on a) the neatness of the clerk who wrote the entry and b)his own ability to spell and c)Harriet Grace's then ability to sign her name and d)the then condition of those ECRs when first handled by NS BDM and e) their condition when indexed and f)the decipher skills of  transcriber team at that time  etc   

Cheers JM

[majm]

I agree with Muss ... Neil found Amelia had died in 1839 and Geo remarried same year ..

Re the Theo at Walgett ...  from his dc ... where was he born and how long in the colonies ... Do you have his mc if so  what info on that please   Cheers Clunky JM

PS do you have Berthas mc for COXHEAD .. Is it a reconciled mc and what info on it  please

Hi Caryn


I think George and Herriot/ Harriet went to NZ not George and Amelia

Emily may have married Andrew Brown 1862  and died 1878 Sydney

I  have not  looked for any of the other children ( who I think may have been
born in NZ)

Glad to help

Muss

[muss]

Hi

A Grace Champion arrived Australia 16 Jan 1839 on ship Alfred she was single


Muss

[muss]

hi

From New Family Search - Marriage 6  Nov  1839-  Sydney

George Glover age 24 to Harriott Champion age 26

Muss

[majm]

Re George Glover, husband of Amelia and then Harriet

NSW ERs 1870  MORPETH
John APPS,. Freehold, Morpeth Rd
Edmund APPS, household, Hunter St (Hinton)
None with surname CHAMPION
Charles Coxhead, household, Swan Street,
Benjamin Coxhead, household, No. 1 Lane
None with surname GLOVER
John GORMAN, household, Largs
Edward King, household, Narrowgut (W Scott’s Estate)
John King, household, Narrowgut, (G T P Close’s Estate
John King, junior, household, Wallalong (W Scott’s Estate)
William King, residence, Wallalong (W Scott’s Estate)
None with surname TANDY

GREVILLES 1872 MORPETH
John APPS, carrier, Morpeth Rd
Charles COXHEAD, labourer, Swan St
Benjamin COXHEAD, labourer Swan St
John KING, jun, farmer Narrowgut
John KING, sen, farmer Phoenix Park

Grevilles 1875 :MORPETH
Charles COXHEAD, Swan St Morpeth
Benjamin COXHEAD, carrier, Swan St, Morpeth.
Albert KING, farmer, Narrowgut
John KING, farmer Narrowgut


Sands 1858 Commercial Sydney
Henry CHAMPION, poulterer, 2 & 4 Market Shed B, pr (Private Residence) Kent St
No George GLOVER

Sands 1861 Commercial Sydney
George Glover, blacksmith, 20 O’Connell St

Caryn, have you searched the City of Sydney’s Assessment Books/Maps for your George Glover?
Here are the links as per NSW Resources Board here at RChat
City of Sydney Assessment Books
http://www.cityofsydney.nsw.gov.au/assessmentbooks/
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=499593.0

Cheers, JM