Author Topic: **COMPLETED** Bertha GLOVER born 1833 Wittersham, Kent arrived Sydney 1837  (Read 48699 times)

Offline majm

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Re: Bertha GLOVER born 1833 Wittersham, Kent arrived Sydney 1837
« Reply #63 on: Monday 05 December 11 04:42 GMT (UK) »
Further to posts # 8, 9, 11, 27 & 28,  I continue to think that it would be sensible to spend some pennies (less than $20Au) on obtaining a transcript copy of Bertha COXHEAD's 1913 d.c.   

But in the meanwhile, perhaps this IM from the SMH of 13 Aug 1913 mentioning a Sarah KING and inserted by her daughter, HJ Coxhead and family may be of interest.  http://trove.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/article/15442695



Cheers,  JM
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Offline majm

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Re: Bertha GLOVER born 1833 Wittersham, Kent arrived Sydney 1837
« Reply #64 on: Monday 05 December 11 04:49 GMT (UK) »
Trove gives the T o L for Joseph Tandy ex the David Malcolm as being granted in Sept 1854, which of course is after the marriage of Mrs Tandy to Mr King.

http://trove.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/article/65715655 Cornwall Chronicle  23 September 1854

Cheers,  JM
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Offline Neil Todd

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Re: Bertha GLOVER born 1833 Wittersham, Kent arrived Sydney 1837
« Reply #65 on: Monday 05 December 11 05:33 GMT (UK) »
Hey caryn, There is seriously wrong entry on NSW BDM it has
in 1870 Groom Jane King marrying bride Elizah Coxhead.
Doubt if anyone could normall pick it up. I believe it should read

Elizah Coxhead marrying Harriet Jane King which of course is  ??? ??? ???

Harriet Jane wasn't she Bertha's Daughter??

Neil ;D ;D ;D
Grewl,Nickerseens,flombastion,Everheads

Offline majm

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Re: Bertha GLOVER born 1833 Wittersham, Kent arrived Sydney 1837
« Reply #66 on: Monday 05 December 11 06:14 GMT (UK) »
Errr

I had pencilled in Mrs Harriet J KING as poss the STEP mum for Bertha ....  Hopefully Caryn will sort this out ....

Thanks Neil for that Index sighting for Jane KING as a groom ....  There's several ODD entries on their indexes

Cheers JM
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Offline majm

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Re: Bertha GLOVER born 1833 Wittersham, Kent arrived Sydney 1837
« Reply #67 on: Monday 05 December 11 11:07 GMT (UK) »
Hi there

Apart from convicts transported to VDL and/or NI I wonder  where else in the years 1845-1852  were convicts landed in Australia?  Could the elusive Mr Tandy  be a Pankhurst Exile lad perhaps?

Cheers JM
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Offline majm

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Re: Bertha GLOVER born 1833 Wittersham, Kent arrived Sydney 1837
« Reply #68 on: Monday 05 December 11 19:57 GMT (UK) »
Hi there,

For several days I have been considering the cutting that Neil posted at reply #39 and thus looking at the names of that Mr TANDY’s fellow passengers.   They include the surname DAWSON, which of course is the surname of one of the witnesses to the May 1853 marriage for Bertha TANDY.   Perhaps it is just one of the co-incidences that crops up in many trees, but it is a tantalising find of course.

I have also looked at the NSW BDM online index, in particular a marriage in 1842 where the bride’s surname displayed at that index is TAUDY ...  I believe it is for Edward S Hall and Emily TANDY  (Vol 76, line 1261) and St Andrews Presbyterian. .... And the likely baptism for that couple’s child Burton R (Vol 33A, line 377, 1843) and sadly the likely death of that lad in 1848 (Vol 33B, line 20)

I have also wondered about your comment that perhaps Isaac Dawson was aged 13 when he witnessed Bertha Tandy’s 1853 marriage.  My reply #29 gave you information about a Frank Allwan Blomfield, who was aged 13 in 1853, and his likely forebears.    While I doubt I have any family connection to any of those families,  I do have a fair understanding of NSW records/indexes/documents/private family papers from first settlement right through to federation, simply because by Gov Macquarie’s time in NSW there were at least three couples who were married in Sydney who were having children in Sydney and without those couples, I would not be here.     Consequently I have a respectable collection of certificates for baptisms, burials, marriages as well as many other items of interest, land grant applications, probate packets, etc.  And of course a fair understanding of how the various institutions (Church and State) were meant to operate and how they actually operated. 

 You will recall that I suggested that Frank Blomfield’s middle name would be ALLMAN.  I am convinced this is correct, basically because I can see that his father was associated with the 48th Regiment of Foot, and so too was Francis Allman.   You will recall that I mentioned “seriously wealthy families” and so I can confirm that Frank’s parents were indeed seriously wealthy, particularly after the death of Richard BROOKS.    So, to me, when I learn that a lad of 13 signed as a witness to a marriage in 1853, I find I ask myself a question ‘WHY, what was the connection? ” was he a godson, perhaps ....  The clergy only needed two persons for the official witnesses.  Your mc has three, one of whom you have suggested may have been aged 13..   

So, apart from my speculative thoughts re the Mr Tandy and the Dawson family may I also offer the following?
(Thanks of course to Mr Geggle and his search engine Google)

Emily TANDY, mother of Burton Robert HALL, was the third wife of Edward Smith Hall.  They were married 3 March 1842 (he was a widower, she a spinster).   Edward Smith HALL was the proprietor of one of the Sydney NSW newspapers, The Sydney Monitor.  Emily TANDY had quite a number of brothers and sisters, and at least one of her brothers was in Sydney before heading off to the California Goldfields, the brother’s name was Burton TANDY.   I can see there are family history buffs currently researching this Emily Tandy and her brother, Burton.   After the death of Burton Robert HALL, in 1848, Emily TANDY’s NSW marriage fails and she returned to England.  But as to Burton TANDY, her brother .....  Well I leave it up to you to make contact with those other current researchers and validate or eliminate Burton TANDY as a possible for your Bertha's first husband.... 

Cheers,  JM   
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Offline Caryn_1

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Re: Bertha GLOVER born 1833 Wittersham, Kent arrived Sydney 1837
« Reply #69 on: Tuesday 06 December 11 09:35 GMT (UK) »
Hi All

I'm hoping that Bertha's death certificate should arrive in a few days and answer a few questions. Hopefully it will answer the question regarding any children - before and during her marriage to Charles Coxhead. Any wonder finding stuff in the BDM's can be so difficult at times......thanks for picking up Neil.... :D

The Sarah King who died in August 1913 - her parents were an Alexander and Eliza. That her daughter was married to someone named Coxhead might be an interesting coincidence, but it could be related too! Bertha died in July 1913, so I'm hanging on her death certificate arriving.

Burton Tandy you reckon majm.... very interesting possibility. Of the Burton Tandy's I can find so far (brother to Emily Tandy), they all have him being born around 1824 and dying in 1861 - unmarried - after taking part in the American Civil War.

I believe Frank Blomfield's middle name was Allman. That's correct. I'm not sure what Stephen's and Bertha's connect was. Perhaps he was their godson. I always believed that Stephen worked for the Blomfield family in some capacity, but I've not been able to prove the connection. Stephen was accidentally killed in 1861 and I'm currently also waiting for information to come from the NSW State Library on the coroners report to say exactly where and how. If it happened at work then that might give me a clue, but the poor sod died on his 61st birthday.... :'(

Cheers
Caryn
Boulden (Cornwall: UK & AUS)
Page, Coxhead, King (AUS)
Glover, Gorham, Stratford (UK & AUS)
Gibson, Tandy, Allum, Savage (UK)
McAndrew (Scotland)
Klein, Deppe, Luth, Emmerich, Studt (Germany & AUS)

Offline majm

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Re: Bertha GLOVER born 1833 Wittersham, Kent arrived Sydney 1837
« Reply #70 on: Tuesday 06 December 11 20:00 GMT (UK) »
Stephen was accidentally killed in 1861 and I'm currently also waiting for information to come from the NSW State Library on the coroners report to say exactly where and how. If it happened at work then that might give me a clue, but the poor sod died on his 61st birthday.... :'( 

I hope the State Library in Sydney can help re the Inquest.     I doubt the State Records can as the Guide (link below) shows that "
For some years, for example, May 1859-Mar 1864 indexes are the only surviving records relating to inquests. For further information about an inquest in this period check newspapers" 
http://www.records.nsw.gov.au/state-archives/guides-and-finding-aids/archives-in-brief/archives-in-brief-4

The National Library of Australia, located in Canberra ACT, has many early newspapers, and only a small number have been digitised. 

Cheers,  JM
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Offline majm

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Re: Bertha GLOVER born 1833 Wittersham, Kent arrived Sydney 1837
« Reply #71 on: Tuesday 06 December 11 20:57 GMT (UK) »
Burton Tandy you reckon majm.... very interesting possibility. Of the Burton Tandy's I can find so far (brother to Emily Tandy), they all have him being born around 1824 and dying in 1861 - unmarried - after taking part in the American Civil War.

There is at least one Burton Tandy noted in several digitised newspapers at Trove, so he was definitely in NSW and in SA in the 'right' timeframe 1845-1852.

Ipswich (Qld was not hived off from NSW until 1859)
 http://trove.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/article/3715322 20 Nov 1847 Moreton Bay Courier.... he was leaving the district
http://trove.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/article/3709634 4 Dec 1847 same paper
http://trove.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/article/3715345 11 Dec 1847 same paper ... did he raise sufficient funds to take the dray with him or had he already left to go overland to South Australia.

Adelaide
http://trove.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/article/71611808 11 July 1848 South Australian auctioning his fine horses after travelling overland
http://trove.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/article/71612572 3 Oct 1848 same paper May not have stayed there long, as there was unclaimed mail advertised for him.

I offer him as a possible candidate for Bertha's first husband, for you to research further.   I have nothing to conclusively show he was that husband.  But if your contacts show he was unmarried when he died, I doubt that would preclude him from having been married to Bertha at some stage and then that marriage fails, perhaps prior to his entry into California, perhaps in search of Gold. The Gold rushes started there several years before California entered the Union in September 9, 1850 .   And both those significant events were of course before the Gold rushes started in NSW.   So if it is the same Burton Tandy who died in the Civil War, then he would have been a 'single' man for many years in the USA as obviously Bertha was in NSW from at least May 1853, married to Stephen King. 

Re Blomfield/Allman et al,  the 48th Regiment of Foot is one of the regiments that interest me as several of my forebears were part of the contingent that arrived via the Dick in Sept 1817.  The regiment's tour of duty immediately before NSW was as garrison in Ireland ...  Where was Burton Tandy born?  I think the other researchers have him as Irish born.  Perhaps he sought out the Blomfield family when he arrived in NSW. 

All speculations of course, but hopefully will help you find your elusive Mr Tandy.

Cheers,  JM
The information in my posts is provided for academic and non-commercial research purposes. 
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