Cecil Howard DUFFY (Born 1888)

[cando]

Previous thread
http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,558200.0.html

Cando

[judb]

The only record for Cecil himself, other than the Victorian ones, seems to be the Queensland electoral roll entry, which seems odd - to me, anyway.

I notice he signed Betty's marriage certificate in January 1941 so he was obviously still in touch with the family who were still at Sutherland St.  I would think he and Amy may have separated as late as 1941 or 1942.  Well done to find the others in residence at 72 Moreland Rd.  They may have been no relation and just letting a room to him - accommodation was very scarce after the war. 

The handwriting that states Mrs R Duffy in 1939 looks different from his signature which seems more rounded in shape - thus I would not attach too much importance to Mrs R Duffy being a different person as I think it may well be an error on the part of the person filling in the form, and transcribed wrongly on the next page.

Judith

[cando]

[quoteThe handwriting that states Mrs R Duffy in 1939 looks different from his signature which seems more rounded in shape - thus I would not attach too much importance to Mrs R Duffy being a different person as I think it may well be an error on the part of the person filling in the form, and transcribed wrongly on the next page.]

I agree with you Judith.

Cando

[majm]

I also agree with Judith and Cando re Mrs R Duffy ....

It is possible the recorder heard "Amy" as though it was "Arrrrmee" and simply wrote "R"

Cheers,  JM

[markdrogers99]

the only reference i have to an 'Mrs R Duffy' in the family history (so far) is the mention by Cecil on his Mobilization Attestation Form in November 1939 indicating 'Mrs R Duffy' as his wife.   At this time he indicates his address is 102 Reynards St, Coburg though to date have not located anyone (even Cecil) with this address.

Am starting to agree with you all that there was no Mrs R Duffy.. but in reference to the separation I think this could have occurred as early as 1939 as Cecil gave his address as 102 Reynards St, Coburg which is not the family home and I have no other record of this address.

[markdrogers99]

Ok... I received Cecil's UK military file and he has revealed a bit more information around his family, more specfically two older brothers that I did not know of.  On his Military application form dated 3 March 1908, Cecil advised the following family members;

Samuel Duffy (father) - address: Stanhope St, Melbourne, Australia
George Duffy (older brother) - address: Buenos Aires, Argentina 
Arthur Duffy (older brother) - address: Montréal, Quebec, Canada

He also listed that he was born in Melbourne, Australia on 3 March 1888, though again it seems he was fibbing about his DOB as 3 March is the date he joined the UK Military in Colchester, Essex, England.

Again I draw a blank with locating any records of his older brothers (along with his father) so at lose as to where now to look.

I would appreciate if anyone could point me in the direction of any resources.

Many thanks,
Mark

[judb]

Hmmm - certainly seems somewhat economical with the truth, does Mr C H Duffy 

The only Samuel DUFFY I see on the electoral rolls in Victoria from 1903-1909 lived in Canning St, Carlton, a labourer.  At the same address is a Clara DUFFY, home duties; Samuel Horace DUFFY, labourer is also at the address in 1909.

There are a few Stanhope Streets in the Melbourne suburban area - West Footscray, Broadmeadows, Malvern, Eltham.  Was there a post code included in the address?  Melbourne had somewhat similar post codes to London in the past - eg the area I lived in was Mont Albert, E10, Vic

However methinks your Cecil may just have made all this up - a brother in Buenos Aires sounds a little over the top - however..................................

Oh he is a frustrating chap   

Judith

[majm]

Hi there,

On Cecil Howard Duffy's 12 pages of his Australian Military records, on his attestion papers dated 14 Feb 1946, he lists his next of kin as :Mrs A Duffy, 42 Morehead Road, etc . Very definitely an "A" in the old handscript.   That document gives his then age as 51 years 10 months, and d o b of 19.4.1894, born Plymouth, Devon England.  If he was actually born in 1888 then he would have been nearly 58 years when he enlisted .... Umm... no wonder he became younger 

At Page 2, his service gives 2.11.1939 to 13.2.1946 with CMF and then with AIF 14.2.1946 to 25 Mar 1947.   

At page 4 of those, it is possible to read that his nok is Mrs R Duffy,  102 Reynards St etc and that was also his then address.  This was 1 Nov 1939.  That handwriting is all capitalised.  His Army no. is V81.911

Page 6, the handwriting is different, the VX number is 129266, and the clerk has simply transferred the info from page 4 to the form on page 6, so the nok becomes Mrs R Duffy.  I think it is a simply transcribed error.

What a mystery.   I wonder if Cecil was one of Australia's chaps in the cold war era....  I wonder if he had a backroom role in the Petrov Affair.  Oh I do love a good mystery....

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Australian_Security_Intelligence_Organisation


Cheers,  JM

[markdrogers99]

@judb - I agree C H Duffy was definitely out to hide his past (or families past) as to date I have yet still to locate birth/death/census/electoral roll records for his parents and now alleged older brothers (apparently all living in the four corners of the world in 1908!).  His UK Military file does not mention a post code or suburb for Stanhope St - he just lists Melbourne, Australia. 

Interestingly enough he listed his occupation when joining the UK military in 1908 as a Ship Steward and had a letter of recommendation from a missionary with the Gordon Smith Institute in Liverpool, England (apart of the Liverpool Seamen's Friendly Society).  On his death certificate in 1960 it was indicated his father was a Minister of Religion..... could his father have been a missionary to seafarers?

http://www.old-merseytimes.co.uk/gordoninstitute.html

Alternatively could it be that C H Duffy was possibly an orphan? In 1915 on his marriage certificate he indicated his father, George Samuel Duffy, was deceased and father's occupation was an Engineer.  Additionally the three witnesses at the wedding in June 1915 in Cornwall, England were;

1. Edward Pengelly (Brides father)
2. Victor Rogers
3. Lily Mary Jones

Interestingly enough C H Duffy's daughter, Ena Margaret Duffy (no birth certificate has been located - b. 1924 d. 1965), was married to S C Brockley when she met my grandfather, Vernon Whitfield, in Melbourne in the late 1940's (possibly early 1950's). They were both married though moved together to Sydney where they changed they're names to ROGERS. Vernon changed his name to Ian though Ena only changed her surname.

This leads me to believe that Victor Rogers (witness at C H Duffy's marriage) was possibly someone significant to either the Pengelly or Duffy family. Alternatively could ROGERS be Cecil's real surname?

@majm - I am currently sifting my way through the electoral roll to see how was living at 102 Reynards St, Coburg around 1939 as this is the only mention of C HI Duffy living at this address, as the family home was 24 Sutherland St, Coburg.

I can understand Cecil stretching the truth of his age to enlist with the Australian Army, as he was a decorated officer in WWI with British Military, awarded an MC and subsequently was recruited into the Royal Irish Constabulary thoughout the  Irish war of independence (1920-1922). Interestingly enough I noticed on his Australian war file that he was based in the Australian Mission in Berlin Germany from I think 1946.  What would he have been doing there? it seems strange post war to be based there? Maybe he was involved in some intelligence work for both Australian and UK governments?? 

I agree with you both, fascinating story though very frustrating at the same time!  All I wanted to find was his birth certificate and his parents records so I could research the 'Duffy' lineage.