Esther CREIGHTON of Coonamble-criminal in 1880's & then what?

[~MERLIN~]

Hi, Ah Esther and George married in Coonabarabran in 1875 not Coonamble,

And from reply #32
Ah Esther and George married in Coonabarabran in 1875 not Coonamble    

So, thanks Neil you are spot on correct, for the NSW BDM online Index gives the marriage as registered in the Coonabarabran District and ref #2332 (1875).  Note to JM, check the Indexes !

Some more thoughts ... As the marriage was not at Coonamble,    

They were married at COONAMBLE it is a transcription error showing COONABARABRAN on the NSW online indexes.
All references on the MC show Coonamble.

[majm]

Thanks Merlin for uploading that snip.  So that's another error on the NSW BDM index ! ....  There's many others of course.  Do you have any other sections of that MC please?

They were married at COONAMBLE it is a transcription error showing COONABARABRAN on the NSW online indexes.
All references on the MC show Coonamble. 

Did Esther sign or make her mark?

Compulsory civil education of NSW children came about in the late 1870's or early 1880's.   So perhaps George Hector's admission papers to the training ship Vernon indicating he had no reading and writing skills when he entered, could also suggest that his siblings may also have not had much formal education.

Cheers,  JM

[majm]

Hi Merlin,

I am interested in what is recorded on that m.c. in the area underneath the entries in columns 6, 7, 8, 9, 10.  Also, I am interested in a transcription of the contents of columns 6  and 8, and I recognise the snip you have uploaded is for columns 2 and 3.

Cheers, JM

[Kylie B]

Hi everyone
Thanks so much for all the info everyone!!

JM- I have the actual MC and it does state the marriage was in Coonamble as per Merlin's post- the index reference to Coonabarrabran is wrong.  Column for birthplace is blank, column for ages is blank, father and mothers names is blank and fathers occupation is blank. It lists George as a sawyer and Esther as a domestic servant. Lists George's place of residence as Nelgowrie or Belgowrie, Coonamble, and lists Esthers place of residence as Coonamble. Witnesses were Peter Dodd and Andrew Cochrane.

And that was my mis-type in #29 with Cooma- sorry!

Esther made her mark on the marriage, George signed his name.

According to the Benevolent Society records for Edith, Emily and Charles- none of them could read or write and had receoved no education. Same said for George Hector on the Vernon records as you mentioned.

Esther is the name she used on her marriage and on the childrens BC's- but since we have not found a birth, as Neil mentioned, I guess she could have just picked that name.....that will make her even harder to find!

It does seem that the Taylor and Tailby families were around the area at the time though, so seems Neils findings in Tamworth are the best bet as yet.

I have sent off a query to Dubbo about the Sisters of Mercy re Sarah.

Heard back again from Coonamble church and they cannot find the register for Esther and George's marriage....they say they will keep looking, but that doesnt sound promising.....

[Neil Todd]

Seems the avenues are narrowing and the misleads are growing.
Not so clever after all. Duh

Umm, Marriage of a Sarah Dorothea Creighton in Qld in 1911
1911/C3109 Husband (Jennings Thomas Richard) Wife (Creighton Sarah Dorothea)

At least right age. there are no births registered to them up to 1914 and obviously can't check NSW

Neil

[majm]

Right, so where are the Coonamble registers .... It was and still is against both Church and Civil LAWS for these to ever be deliberately destroyed...  Two were used concurrently, both to be kept separately and in safe places.  In C of E, usual for one to be in the Priest's room at the Church Building and one to be kept in the Manse.  In both instances fire proof safes were usually installed. 

Kylie, some more questions 
  is your Coonamble source saying that only George and Esther's marriage record is missing OR are both those registers missing? 
  Have you asked the Coonabarabran C of E if they are holding those registers (perhaps leading on from the transcript error on the NSW BDM index,) I wonder if the SAG transcribers were using Church registers obtained from Coonabarabran for the Coonamble marriages !!!   
  Have you contacted the Diocese HQ at Bathurst to ask where the Coonamble registers are currently located, and if they can shed any light on that 1875 marriage? 

Also, I have looked for Esther under HESTER, (a known variant) but alas, nought there too.

Re any children for Thomas Richard JENNINGS .... there's some RChatters with access to NSW birth rego to 1918     
re TRJ perhaps he enlisted for WWI .... http://www.naa.gov.au/collection/using/search/index.aspx

Also, there's that possible mention of "Dorothy" again, as in Dorothy Whalan .... IF that's Esther's youngest daughter, Sarah Dorothea CREIGHTON ....      in Queensland...

Cheers,  JM

[majm]

Also, that Qld 1911 marriage was on 18 April 1911....   

ADDING

1960 NSW BDM index d.c. registration #26219 :

Registered at Rockdale .... Sarah JENNINGS, 84 years, (so possibly NOT Esther's dau) died at Kogarah,  but father's given name GEORGE, mother's given name UNKNOWN ...   

JM

[Kylie B]

Hmmm- maybe if the children were fostered/adopted, their adoptive mother or carer was Dorothy Whalan...although that wouldnt explain the middle name of Esther's daughter.

Apparently the register that would include George and Esthers marriage is 'missing'...wondered if I should contact the local Family history group to see if they might have transcribed them?? Would that be worth a try?

I do think the Tamworth Taylors and Tailby's look promising, but we need that church record.....

[majm]

Suggestions
1. Email C of E at Coonabrarbran and ask them to check if they have (or have a record of having had) Coonamble's register OR do they know who you can ask
2. Email C of E at Bathurst (Diocese HQ) AND ask them the same
3. Email the various family history groups explain what the NSW BDM have supplied you with, and can they help (or know where/who you can ask) to fill in the blanks
4. Find another mc for Coonamble for 1875 or there abouts for a (make a good guess) possible family member, or for the witnesses to Esther and George's marriage .... You are aiming at assuming Esther had siblings (unusual for a lass born c 1859 in NSW NOT to have siblings) .....  You are looking for a lass YOUNGER than Esther, and hoping that the bit on that newer mc will include the name of the person giving consent to the marriage (I am presuming it will NOT be a reconciled mc, thus of little value to family history, but that ONE clue could help  CAUSE .... perhaps George Creighton or Esther Creighton were witnesses to that marriage      or perhaps Esther's parents were witnesses (you still won't be able to prove that relationship BUT it is one step closer).  I call that the LEAP OF GUESSIMATING rule ....    cause it really is NOT the 'right' way to research.

Re middle names ... and to expand that pool .... sometimes the godparents names are included in the child's name !!!

I think you need to get to the NSW SRO to look at the Deposition registers to find further info about the children, and perhaps to find Esther's admission to Coonamble Gaol etc.   I don't think there is much more available from the armchair 

PS, Next NSW BDM mc, MY TIP .... Well I would be into trying to save some pennies and get an official transcript, same info as the real deal, and you may need to get several more ...

Cheers,  JM