Author Topic: 1907 railway death  (Read 8430 times)

Offline EHDD

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Re: 1907 railway death
« Reply #18 on: Monday 10 October 11 11:57 BST (UK) »
Further to previous posts on this topic. Firstly I must congratulate ‘noytd’ on the thoroughness of the research undertaken at the PRO Kew. I am rather perplexed at the lack of any formal reference to this fatality. A fireman’s duties involved a fair amount of clambering over the locomotive, for example in pulling coal forward from the tender, filling the water tank from lineside water columns, and altering the locomotive’s lampcode carried either at the front or rear of the locomotive depending on the direction of travel. All these duties involved working at some height above the rail level. In addition, depending on local circumstances, it was the fireman’s responsibility to couple and uncouple the locomotive from its train and where necessary at the driver’s direction he would leave the locomotive in order to notify the signalman of the train’s presence when waiting at a signal on a running line beyond the time stipulated in the rules. All these duties involved the fireman having to climb up into and out of the locomotive’s cab and were in addition to his principal duty of maintaining steam for the driver and helping him watch for line side signals. Most of the additional duties referred to were undertaken when the locomotive was stationary. But all were tinged with danger, a moment’s lack of concentration or a slip could result in death or serious injury. 
I have looked at the accident archive mentioned in a previous post and would respectfully point out that it does not include the Assistant Inspecting Officers’ reports on staff injuries mentioned in my earlier post. It only details the accidents subject to detailed Railway Inspectorate inquiries which by the early 1900s were only a very small proportion of the accidents that actually happened. By this time Railway Companies like the LNWR generally carried out an internal investigation into each accident the report of which was forwarded to the Railway Inspectorate who then decided whether the circumstances of the accident dictated an independent investigation by the Railway Inspectorate. The reports of these formal investigations generally into major collisions or derailments were published and these are the ones listed in the accident archive mentioned above.
I had assumed that the accident at Warrington was the subject of an internal investigation by the LNWR and that a report was forwarded to the Railway Inspectorate. In this case it appears that no report was forwarded by the LNWR to the Railway Inspectorate. But it is known that the death was the subject of a Coroner’s inquiry. In this event because the death occurred on a railway the Coroner was legally obliged to notify the Board of Trade of the fatality. This duty had been introduced because in the early days of railways not all fatalities were reported by the companies to the Board of Trade. The legal requirement placed on the Coroner to notify the Board of Trade of all railway fatalities was therefore introduced to act as a safeguard. The Coroners’ returns of Railway Fatalities to the Board of Trade may still survive in the PRO Kew and do not appear to have been investigated by the researcher.
The other possibility is that the fatality at Warrington was recorded in the LNWR’s Register of Accidents. Warrington was located in the Company’s Northern Division and this Register may still exist. When I visited the PRO several years ago I inspected the Accident Register kept by one of the small Railway Companies taken over by the GWR in 1922. I was required to give an undertaking that any information contained in the Register would not be published but I found the information I was searching for.
Finally I would reiterate that the online Railway Accident Archive, though useful, is certainly not a complete record and that much more information is available in the Railway Inspectorate Quarterly and Annual Reports. For example between the years 1874 & 1876 lists giving the names of all employee fatalities and latterly injuries were published. After this date presumably to reduce the physical length of the Returns only statistical information was published. Publication of this continued until the onset of the Assistant Inspecting Officers Reports in about 1900 when investigations were undertaken into employee injuries and fatalities. But it would seem that the Assistant Inspecting Officers only concentrated on certain categories of accident and the incident at Warrington did not fall into one of these. I can only suggest that the locomotive was stationary and that the fireman simply slipped and fell while climbing up into or leaving the cab and that it was just a tragic accident.

John(Helen’s husband)

Offline Redroger

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Re: 1907 railway death
« Reply #19 on: Tuesday 11 October 11 10:43 BST (UK) »


Previosuly I had failed to throughouly read the wreaths section of the funeral report (mainly as its extremely hard to read). However, one of the wreaths was from the "Associated Society of Enginemen and Firemen (north and South sheds)" and another wreath from "*unable to read* and Benefit Society (sheds)." I am assuming that this indicates that he was indeed a union member?

Yes, definitely ASLEF, the "Benefit Society" does look to be a possibility. On most if not all of the railways companies at that time there was no sick pay scheme, however, many of the companies did provide a voluntary contributory scheme for their staff, and the dues were deducted directly from the persons' wages. Some records of these societies have survived (e.g.GNR at Doncaster) and where this is the case they are lodged in the local record office, so this does give another possible line of enquiry, the title would be something like LNWR (Enginemens'?) Sick and Funeral  Benefit Society.

I would like to offer my congratulations to John for his comprehensive covering of many aspects of the reports.
Ayres Brignell Cornwell Harvey Shipp  Stimpson Stubbings (all Cambs) Baumber Baxter Burton Ethards Proctor Stanton (all Lincs) Luffman (all counties)

Offline noytd

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Re: 1907 railway death
« Reply #20 on: Tuesday 11 October 11 22:19 BST (UK) »
Many many thanks John for that very informative and useful posting, much appreciated.

I have tried looking at the funeral report again to see if I can make out things on it. The Benefit Society is unfortunately smudged but it looks like a four letter word, with the last three letters in lower case, but I can't make any of them out. The Oddfellow's Society seem to be the ones taking charge of the funeral the most - "At the graveside the Rev. S.G. Lloyd read the concluding sentences of the burial services, and the form of service appointed by the Oddfellow's Society was afterwards read by one of the brethren."

I am assuming that Crewe would have had its own branch of ASLEF? I have had a look at the Warwickshire University online catalogue and it doesn't seem to mention Crewe. Any ideas on who I should make an enquiry to?

The only other thing I have noted is that his funeral was held on a Sunday. Was this usual at the time? Or would it only occur on a Sunday to allow his fellow workers (according to the report over 170 turned up) to attend the funeral?

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Re: 1907 railway death
« Reply #21 on: Wednesday 12 October 11 16:34 BST (UK) »
How are the branches listed in the Warwick University catalogue?  Crewe would certainly have its own branch(es) of ASLEF, and you have previously mentioned North and South sheds if I remember correctly, it may be listed as North shed (Crewe) etc., but I would try and get in touch with the local current branch secretary. He might even have an old document which would point you towards the branch name. The Odd Fellows conducted the funeral I would think on the basis of "He who pays the piper calls the tune"

I think your assumption regarding the funeral being held on Sunday is probably correct, in those days it was a 6 day working week, with no time off, and if you werre lucky one week holiday a year.
Ayres Brignell Cornwell Harvey Shipp  Stimpson Stubbings (all Cambs) Baumber Baxter Burton Ethards Proctor Stanton (all Lincs) Luffman (all counties)


Offline wyndham

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Re: 1907 railway death
« Reply #22 on: Wednesday 12 October 11 22:54 BST (UK) »
To add to the locomotive sheds at Crewe, there was a small one at Gresty Road that belonged to the GWR.

Offline noytd

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Re: 1907 railway death
« Reply #23 on: Thursday 13 October 11 10:20 BST (UK) »
I found a list of the branch records held by Warwickshire University here:

http://dscalm.warwick.ac.uk/DServe/dserve.exe?dsqIni=Dserve.ini&dsqApp=Archive&dsqCmd=NaviTree.tcl&dsqDb=Catalog&dsqItem=ALF/8&dsqField=RefNo#HERE

I'll email ASLEF to see if I can get contact details for the Crewe Branch Secretary.

My great grandfather, Alfred Jenkins, was based at the GWR shed in Crewe. Thats another one of my family mysteries. My ancestors all worked for LNWR, but for some unknown reason Alfred worked for GWR eventually becoming an engine driver.

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Re: 1907 railway death
« Reply #24 on: Thursday 13 October 11 12:00 BST (UK) »
I have thoroughly examined the information provided by Warwick University, what is immediately apparent is that their record holding is badly incomplete in several geographical areas (including Crewe) This I think leaves open three possibilities:
1) The records have been lost. I think this is unlikely 2) The records are still at branch level, or in the hands of a regional official of the union, more likely or 3) The historical records from closed branches have been deposited in local archive collections. I imagine that many records come into this category, the problem will be finding them.
Ayres Brignell Cornwell Harvey Shipp  Stimpson Stubbings (all Cambs) Baumber Baxter Burton Ethards Proctor Stanton (all Lincs) Luffman (all counties)

Offline Archiford

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Re: 1907 railway death
« Reply #25 on: Friday 11 November 11 19:20 GMT (UK) »
The Modern Records Centre at Warwick holds the archives of ASLEF. This includes membership lists in the annual reports. There are also reports of deaths in railway accidents for 1907 in the Railway Review and Records of Accidents.
http://www2.warwick.ac.uk/services/library/mrc/explorefurther/subject_guides/family_history/rail/asrs/

The branch records do not usually contain membership information - they are administrative records. Membership registers of the ASRS (Amalgamated Society of Railway Servants) is partially indexed now  for members who joined between 1872-1888.

Offline noytd

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Re: 1907 railway death
« Reply #26 on: Wednesday 01 August 12 22:07 BST (UK) »
I just wanted to put up an update that basically concludes my search for how my ancestor was killed.

Having hit a brick wall, I left my search for Charles's death and moved onto other genealogical lines of research. Today I was looking on the British Newspaper Archive to see if I could find any mention of members of another family lines. With a bit of time to kill I typed in "Jenkins Warrington" and set some filters. I couldn't believe my luck!

His death was briefly recorded in the Manchester Courier and Lancashire General Advertiser (26 April 1907). The inquest is not recorded but it gives the very basic facts of what happened. While the train was near Warrington (presumably coming up to the station) it was noticed that Charles was missing. He was later found injured on the railway line and died later that same day in Warrington Infirmary of head injuries. So it would appear that he fell off a moving train and that their was no witnesses to his fall. However, I am guessing that initially he was taken to the station where he died (place of death on the death certificate), and then that the body was taken to the infirmary?