BBC TV "WDYTYA?" Series 9 Episode #7: Robin Gibb

[annaS]

I agree both Alan Carr and this one were boring.  My two faves to date (that I can remember!) are Davina McCall who I'm not really a fan of and Jason Donovan - ditto for him but very interesting tales to be had in both progs

I think that  my favourite so far has to be David Dickinson; and what about Matthew Pinsent descending from God!

Anna

The first two lines of this are quoting Petros

[nospringchicken]

                   The other story of interest to me was that of the mid-wife. My dear old spinster great -aunt Doss was a mid-wife around Devizes. I remember well that she was definitely of the 'no nonsense' school when it came to applying first aid but she was much loved. The newspaper article on her retirement reckoned she must have brought 3,000 - 4,000 locals into the world and the civic dignitaries launched an appeal to fund her old age as she had been seriously under paid. Her subsequent funeral was very well attended. I am glad that such as she are getting the recognition that they deserve.

Phil

Hi Phil,

I'm glad as well! Maybe you can answer the question I asked earlier. You say your great aunt Doss was also a midwife. I assume she was also formally qualified through the Midwifery Board? And that she remained single?

 I know that nurses had to "retire" when they married. Did the marriage bar also apply to midwives?

I did ask whether it was verified that James Lynch was in fact Cecelia Lynch's husband - the head of the household didn't necessarily mean that the person was the husband. I noted he was a "cow man", maybe very handy for a mdiwife dealing with babies! But seriously, if she wasn't married to him and he was perhaps her brother or cousin for example it throws up all sorts of questions as to who the children in the household were. The programme by mentioning "head of household" could have led viewers to assume James was the husband, along with the *crossed out* "wife". But it wasn't really verified. And as we know, censuses are often a little dodgy ....

*Just to correct the above. Cecelia was married to James Lynch and married him before she started to practice. Thanks to the BBC board for this info!

From what was said in the programme, midwives were paid fees by the families whose babies they delivered. In a poverty-stricken area, this must have been very difficult. In a sense, the midwife was doing a job for, if we bring it down to pre-NHS days although the state was already encroaching with National Health Insurance for men (although not women and children), panel doctors and health boards, the councils and parishes. And of course many of the guys within the councils did get salaries and occupational pensions.  

By 1948 GPs surely must have been getting a steady income from "fees" from insurance companies because National Health Insurance was administered through insurance companies "The Man from the Pru" for working men but there wasn't anything comparable for midwives? And the working men were supposed to pay for the ailments/child bearing of their wives and ailments of unmarried sisters etc as "dependents"?

There was a hotchpotch of state legislation coming in, National Health Insurance, Adoption legislation and registration, council regulations etc etc.

Maybe midwives were supposed to be dependent on the GPs and by trickle down, once the state through various health boards (and there was increased coverage for children as well through schools), county councils and insurance companies came in, were supposed to get fees from the GPs for their services and not from individuals? This might also explain why the academic in Salford was so forthright about the doctors running the Midwifery Board? Maybe the GPs were still trying to make out they were not being paid by corporations and the state to cover healthcare in their local areas?

[julianb]

While he wasn't demonstrative, Robin Gibb was clearly passionate about clearing his great grandmother's name.

I was interested in the handloom weaver and the history of the Paisley hand loom weaving industry. It didn't seem that the Paisley area adopted powered looms, maybe they didn't have the water or the coal. My home based hand loom woollen weavers in Yorkshire carried on with their trade and with farming their bit of land, while their sons and daughters went to work in the mills down in the valleys.

No land in the centre of Paisley to farm!  Paisley had plenty of water though with the White Cart Water running through its centre and plenty of mills close by. 

The mills took over from the weavers.   The town then became a major centre for cotton thread.  Coats were a major employer.

But it was exciting seeing references to Causeyside Street - a place which always seems to crop up in conversations between my better half and her mother about their home town of Paisley.

JULIAN

[nospringchicken]

.......... if I remember rightly, that he was demoted from being a corporal and then took eight years to become a corporal again? Or perhaps the latter was a warrant officer and not a corporal?

Hi

the way i remember the programme is he was a corporal and got busted for drunkenness. It then took eight years for him to become a corporal again. However this was not the end of the story as in time he did go on to become a Staff (?) sargeant by the time he retired, which they seemed to equate with being a warrant officer (or perhaps he was retired as a warrant officer - its not unknown to promote someone just before retirement to give them a bigger pension)

It could well be about the pension. as you say especially with the Samuel Crompton connection. Even at the beginning of the National Health Service, the GPs claimed they did not want to become employees because of "clinical independence" but didn't demur when offered an NHS pension so got a nice little set up like the MPs, 'self employed' for tax purposes but with an occupational pension although I believe in the NHS terms of service for GPs there was a regulation that they were not allowed to accept outside fees except from health service authorities!

as far as I know welfare legislation before the coordination of all the legislation of 1948 was really based on Bismarck's "warfare state" and not about welfare per se.  It was to make sure there was a ready supply of healthy males for the armed forces and to defend the Empire.  So the public health boards, as well as being about communicable diseases, and other public health provisions at both local and national levels were very much tied up with the provision of men for the armed forces in every county. So it was in the interests of local government to make sure there were enough health workers. I guess now it's the United Nations at the top of the tree providing soldiers from all around the world for the many conflicts around the globe!

The later theories of the US doctor, Dr Spock, whom some here may remember was based on slightly different lines - to provide babies who would be good workers in factories and for conveyor belt manufacturing industries - hence the emphasis on not picking up the babies when they were crying, feeding them at set times etc etc as Dr Spock and his acolytes were under the illusion this would somehow provide punctual workers used to routines!

[Paul Caswell]

+73 Informative

Fascinating!!!

[Viktoria]

 I never considered Dr. Spock`s aims were to produce babies who would become good workers on conveyor belts in  factories!
His ideas  were to give young parents confidence in their role as parents and to trust their natural instincts. He told them that they knew much more than they thought they did and not to be afraid of
loving and enjoying their baby.They know their baby better than anyone.
He does warn against becoming a  "slave " to a baby by not using common sense but by actually wanting to be a slave to them by spoiling. However he does say that a baby  is not spoiled by being  comforted when in distress through hunger, pain or discomfort.A baby not so comforted will grow up  cold and unresponsive .
 When it  comes to discipline it all depends on  what spirit  is put into managing the child. Over harshness and excessive  leniency  are more damaging  than  good hearted firmness from a confident parent.   Viiktoria.

[bevbee]

A very slow episode with far too much padding.

I enjoyed seeing his house though. 

[Alba]

It is a shame that they didn't take Robin to the 'Sma  'Shot Cottages' in Paisley.
Allowing him to see a loom in situation and the size of a house, that his family
may have lived in.   

 http://www.smashot.co.uk  this gives the 'story of Paisley's weaving heritage'.

[Tricia55]

Hi there, hope I'm not butting in, I just wanted to say that I thought this programme was a bit on the slow side too, the one of this series that has stuck out for me was Larry Lamb, I found it so interesting and very emotional, I thought it was fantastic that he actually met a living relative.

Tricia