George SUMMERS

[majm]

Do you know how long your George Summers had been at the Liverpool Asylum?

There's a G. Sommers listed in the 1900 Sands Alphabetical directory of Sydney.  The closing date for the printers was usually the end of October of the prior year. 

Here's the listing for a G Sommers  (with 'o' not 'u') at 30 Victoria St Nth Sydney.
There's also these two listings that may be of interest
George Summers 40 Abattoirs Rd, Balmain
George Summers 81 Curtis Rd, Balmain.

Cheers,  JM

[jel]

Thank you very much for the Sands information. the George Summers in Curtis Street was the one I had been researching for two years, the incorrrect one. BUT maybe the other one you found in Abattoirs Rd is MY George Summers. Thanks a lot. George was admitted to the hospital in November 1899. Thanks a lot as well for your advice about the MC not having all the information. I think I will investigate that further with the church. Janet

[majm]

Re your George Summers at the Liverpool Asylum. 

From that d.c. what was the recorded cause/s for his death in 1900.

Why do you assume he was buried as a pauper at the Pioneer Park at Liverpool?  What cemetery is noted on that d.c? 

The Pioneer Memorial Park was established in 1970 and includes the old St Lukes Cemetery....

http://www.liverpool.nsw.gov.au/pioneersmemorialpark.htm

Here's a link to someone researching Kathleen Amy Summers  http://www.rootschat.com/links/0efk/

 .... perhaps there's some clues for you to verify various details against various holdings in Victorian archives, which if like NSW archives are often found not just at the Archives/Records Office but in State Libraries, genealogy societies, family history groups etc ...  I feel sure that there's various copies of the NSW Directories (not just the Sands ones) within the holdings of at least some of those groups.   

At that shrunken link above, it shows a researcher has Elizabeth Peisley's birth (hopefully from a baptismal record as it was pre civil registrations in NSW)  and both her marriages, (Flide and Summers), so it seems to me that when George married Elizabeth, she would have been noted as Elizabeth Flide on that marriage registration, and her status on the m.c. should be widow, nee Peisley.   So I would anticipate you could follow that through at the local parish records simply with an email to their archivist who may well be a volunteer. 

Oops,  Edit to Add .... perhaps I have missed your answers...

.....

Do you have copy or transcript copy of George's
a) marriage certificate
b) death certificate
......

Cheers,  JM
 

[majm]

Hi Janet,

Just noticed that I have not posted this newspaper cutting re George Summers, so Kathleen, even though in South Africa from shortly after her first marriage, and through her divorce from that chap, must have had contact with her Dad, and may well have been the sole beneficiary of his estate, if her mother was already deceased.  His estate simply may not have needed to be probated. 

It is possible that any headstone on his grave may have been lost between 1900 and 1970 when the Pioneer Memorial Park was established.  Of course these are speculative  but perhaps worthy of consideration when addressing any 'pauper' issues.   Someone provided the informant on his d.c. with the information as to his parentage, and from my point of view that would usually indicate someone with a family connection to George provided that detail which in turn is displayed on the NSW BDM online index.  I feel sure that who-ever provided that information would have been approached prior to his burial with the view to provide funds towards the cost of that burial, and thus there is a valid reason to consider if his was a pauper burial or a "funded" burial. 

" MARRIAGES.
ATTWELL-HANKEY -August 1, at Newcastle, Natal, William Wilton, fourth son of the late James Attwell, British Kaffraria CC , to Kathleen Amy, daughter of the late George Summers of New South Wales."

http://trove.nla.gov.au/ndp/del/article/14717823 31 October 1905 SMH

Have you explored the various resources boards here at RChat ....  Here's the link to the Australian one, scroll down and within that there's each of the states/territories.   Lots of good and easy to access links there .   http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php/board,399.0.html

Cheers,  JM

[majm]

Hi Janet,

It is somewhat difficult for me to determine from your original post, if you may already have the following information about George Summers... but here is a chap who was born in 1838 whose father was a Baker on the 1841 Census, but that father was not around that neighbourhood on the 1851 Census, when that particular George was 12 and living with his mother, and others, at the next door address to their 1841 address.   The 1851 head of the household was that chap's 'step-brother' ... (which of course in those times also could mean 'half-brother')

So, perhaps this is new information for you, and gives you something to research further re your George Summers and his likely Scottish origins.

Here’s my transcript of an index showing George Summers aged 2 in 1841 in the following household at 55 Bisto Street Edinburgh:
David Summers, a BAKER,
George Summers, 2,
Jannet Summers, 30,
John Young 12,
Alexander Young 10,
James Young 6,
Margaret Young 8,
Margaret Robertson 16

Here's my transcript of an index showing George Summers and Alexander Young at 53 Bisto St in 1851 ...
Alexander Young 30, Master Baker, employing 2 men.
Janet Henderson, mother, 43
Margaret Young 19,
James Young 17,
George Summers, step brother 12,
Henry Dick, 15

Also there’s an index (Scotland Births and Baptisms, 1564-1950) showing George Summers born 26 May 1838 in Edinburgh, son of David Summers and Janet Henderson.

And there’s an index (Scotland Marriages, 1561-1910) showing David Summers married Janet Henderson or Young 10 Apr 1837 at St Cuthberts, Edinburgh.  Her father was noted as John Henderson.

I am not sure if there's anything further I can follow up for you, I am not Sydney based, so my access to Archival material is limited to online indexes and then pondering over spending pennies on ordering the various items that may interest me.   I presume you have checked the archival records at Melbourne's Public Records Office of Victoria.  I understand it includes not just the Victorian Archives, but also the National Archives of Australia's Victoria office.

http://prov.vic.gov.au/visiting-us   

Cheers,  JM

[jel]

Thanks once again, JM, for your assistance. Yes, that is my George Summers in the 1841 and 1851 census. Janet (Jeannette) Summers was married before to Alexander Young before marrying David Summers. I haven't had much of a chance to look up anything in Victoria yet as I have been concentrating so far on the NSW side of things as far as George Summers is concerned. It is probably because I know he was in Orange in 1874 and 1875 and I know he died in NSW in 1900. Thank you for the link which I didn't have, I will have a look at it now. One thing I have discovered in the NSW BMD is that there is only one Janet Summers that died in NSW and her father is listed as a "Campbell" and that's not right. This makes me think that maybe George's parents, David and Janet or (Jeannette) were not living in NSW, maybe they stayed in Victoria.
Regards Janet

[jel]

Good thinking about the pauper or funded burial, I hadn't thought of that. I actually wondered how there was so much information on the DC. thanks for the Rootschat link, I am still learning my way around this website.
Janet

[jel]

thanks too for the newspaper cutting. I think I have exhausted the newspapers for news of the family but I still keep on looking! Janet

[majm]

Hi Janet,

Re the 1899 death for a Janet Summers on the NSW BDM online. 

The information on the index shows that particular person’s father’s given name as unknown Campbell and that the death occurred at North Sydney and was registered at the NSW BDM offices for the St Leonards district.  (#10845) 

The information on a d.c. is only as reliable as the informant’s on knowledge, and it has not been checked by the NSW BDM for its accuracy.  The index could be for someone else other than your George Summer’s mother.  A transcript of that d.c. would provide you with the details for the informant, and it would also provide you with that particular Janet Summers then age, any marriage/s, the names and ages of any children of those marriages, her usual residence, cause of death, and the burial details ... funeral director, clergy, cemetery etc. 

Perhaps the most significant piece of information if that would be for your George’s mother, would be the number of years in the colonies, as often it shows how many years in each separate colony.

Re Immigration to the Antipodes 

Do you have any evidence to suggest that George’s parents came to any of the colonies? 
Have you considered if George or any of his immediate family may have come via New Zealand, or may have used the surnames Summers, Young or Henderson?

 I ask because:

When I was transcribing the census information for you I noticed on the 1851 census that George’s mother’s surname was recorded as Henderson.

I also noticed that David Summers was not there, and that a 20 year old was the Master Baker with 2 employees. 

To my way of thinking, as David Summers was the Baker in 1841, and then his step-son becomes the Baker in 1851 and David is not present, that may well indicate that David had died rather than immigrated.  The Scottish census was taken 30/31 March 1851. 

If David and Janet came to Australia, perhaps David came before her, and then sent for her, perhaps the marriage failed and David and George came to the colonies.  Perhaps Janet remained in Scotland and reverted to Henderson, which would be her maiden surname. 

So perhaps there’s later Scottish census for the Janet Henderson that would be for your George’s mother. So perhaps there’s Scottish death registrations for George’s mother and father.   

However, speculations are simply that.  Primary Records provide the paperwork trail, and as  I am not familiar with researching Scottish primary records, , I hope you make contact with the submitter mentioned on the Australian Royalty family history link I gave earlier.  They seem to have quite a deal of information, perhaps they have good understanding of the various UK paperwork trails. They may even have researched information to share directly with you.

If you do decide to follow up on that NSW 1899 death registration for Janet Summers, may I suggest you look at ordering a transcript from an official transcription agent.  These are cheaper and quicker and can arrive in your email inbox as an attachment, eg pdf file...

Cheers,  JM