COOPERS in Surrey area

[casalguidi]

Is she the Lavinia READING who died circa early 1973 in the Sutton, Surrey registration district?  If so, her date of birth given in the death indexes is 11 Sep 1891 though, of course, this is only as accurate as known by the person who registered the death.

Do any living family know if she had any brothers/sisters and their names/marriages/info etc.?

Are the names of witnesses on Lavinia's marriage certificate any use ie. could they have been relatives?

Is there any address given for her on the marriage certificate?

Have you found Lavinia in the 1911 census?  I think I can see Elvy as "Alby" with a John and Edward of the correct age in the free index living in the Kingston, Surrey registration district http://www.1911census.co.uk/

Casalguidi

[RankGorger]

Whilst I can't be 100% sure, I'm going with the assumption that, yes, that is her death record.

I didn't know of that 1911 census record, but looking at it makes me wonder if it's a different family from the 1901 census:

- It says that John is only 7 years older (not 10)
- The gap between husband and wife's ages has shortened from 7 years to 2 years
- Amey has changed to Alby
- Edward seems to be an only child as opposed to having at least 5 siblings
- John is now a greengrocer instead of travelling gypsy

Thanks for having a look. I'll try and get the marriage certificate.

[social-butterflies]

hi steve g

its not my line but this one was rat cather to the queen 
seems quite possible that they could be connected
a.

[Steve G]

This one was rat cather to the queen 

 Precisely. And my mates Dad was 'Rat Catcher' to HM Dockyard ..... My mate, having taken over, now services general MOD sites all around the central south of england.

 He must be pushing sixty by now. Assuming he was born when his Dad was about twenty? ..... Sorry. I can't count to save my life  But, what? Maybe a couple of generations?

 As far as I'm aware, the royals no longer have personal Rat Catchers. But, equally, I don't expect ye got a whole, Royal Dockyard to yeself, just by going to the Labour Exchange and applying either.

 And Cooper all the way? Starting to walk remarkably like a duck, isn't it? I wonder if we're onto something here? Just to spice things; I'd imagine ye aware of possibly The most famous Rat Catcher to The Queen: " Jack Black ". Pattern emerging ....?

 I'm off to Google " Matty Cooper ~ Rat Catcher " 


Apologies to " Rank Gorger " if we've somewhat bent this thread. But, is it not fascinating to consider the Cooper family as a whole? Can't get too much 'feel' for a people, I always feel

[aug]

Hi RankGorger

Sorry i did not get to you sooner.. About my GG-grandparents Harriet cooper and George Gladwin. They used to live in a tent on mitcham common. And i don't know what timescale they moved to wilford rd. All i know they lived at 24 wilford rd?  Maybe i might come across the date sometime.

jew

[FIFI]

Hi Rank Gorger
Just to throw another thought in to this, some of the Coopers from Wilford Road also went under the name of Williams, and were related to Samuel Cooper of Crystal Palace. He died in a fire trying to put out a chimney fire with his son Nelson  I am not sure of the dates at moment as not done any research for a long long time.
hope this is of some help

[nightnurse51]

Hi
I am directly related to the "Norwood" Coopers which stemmed from King of the Gypsies Samuel Cooper b 1794 who died putting out a chimney fire in 1856. They lived originally on South Norwood Hill also known as Gypsy hill
His son Robert Cooper who "married" Sylvia Williams. as they were not married a lot of the children went under the name of Williams and others under Cooper depending on what they felt at the time.
A lot of the Coopers moved to Wilford and Forster Road Croydon after Gypsy Hill South Norwood was purchased by the train company that built Gypsy hill station.
Matthias Cooper the royal ratchatcher that befriended the young Queen Victoria is related to the Norwood Coopers way back through James and Harriet.
Joshua Cooper who is related to matthias Cooper, "married" Alathiah (many spellings of this name) Taylor originally of Nottinghill. She died in 1902. She had several children that some carried the name of Cooper, some Taylor and she had a liason with Fighting Sam Smith of whom they had a daughter called Isobella/Isabella Smith.
She married into my Hunt Family.
Flora Mills daughter of Flora Cooper and Aaron Mills  married into the same Taylor family marrying Alfred Taylor who we believe to be the son of Athaliah. but we cannot find his birth record.
Alfreds family grave in Queens road cemetry has Daniel Cooper and his wife Jane (nee Mills) I asked the grandaughter of Irene Taylor daughter of Alfred who is the main person named in the grave of why Daniel and his wife were there and she repied that Alfred Taylor and Daniel were brothers.
The Cooper 's of Croydon are all intergrated every where and I have to go to work now and I will study the conversation and see if I can help anyone
Idf you cannot find a family member after the fathers name try looking if its been transcrivbed as the MOThers name.
This happened quite often, as the law stands today also, if you are not married you must register a child legally with either the father being there if the child is to have the fathers name or the childs name would have to be registered in the mothers name. If so on the census you may find the child is known as the fathers name.
Very complicated and my gypsy heritage has caused me a lot of headaches.
If one relationship broke up and they started another children could well be related but carry different names, but on the census could all carry the same name.
Il be back about 1030 tonight.

[nightnurse51]

to Gorger Just noticed your entry that your coppers lived in 24 Wilford Road, well my dad was born in 23 Wilford Road.but  many many years later.
Also Wilford Road and Forster Roads are no longer in existance, they started to pull them down just before the 1939 war and it was known as Bangole and bombs destroyed the rest of it.
Alot of the families from these two roads are buried in Queens Road Cemetary which was situatted at the end of these two roads.

[aug]

Hi

If anyone want to find out about coopers from mitcham common and wilford rd. Where mine came from.
 Theres a site called WWW.knowhere croydon message board. Log in Banghole nick name for wilford rd Etc.
Most on their are related to coopers. Got loads in my tree. And i look at graves in Queens rd croydon and found some coopers. And found a family member i add these graves to names on my tree. Plus found other family graves.  I found a tony on the croydon message board related to my coopers.

jew