Code in a Non-Conformist Register

[sunnylew]

I must say my first thought upon seeing Netti's code was that it was in Linear B, the ancient Greek Script, but this script wasn't deciphered until the late 1950's and I don't think Linear A has yet been uncontestedly deciphered.

The theban script definitely has similarities to parts of the code in both books, but it almost looks, especially in Netti's, that someone has grabbed some symbols from this that and the other code to make one of their own.

[Greensleeves]

I have been playing about with one of the pages and noted the similarities of phrases; not that this really helps with deciphering of course but interesting nonetheless.

[Storm™]

The fact that he uses numbers may provide a clue. That maybe his written symbols are a code rather than a language. If it had a numerical symbol he should have used it there also. Instead he writes that in. Any language would have a numerical symbology as well. Here he uses English numerics but coded text. This gives three possibilities - he left the dates in English for ease of reference. Someone else had access to the text and would need to refer to it, contacting him to translate, there was no numerical system in his codes.

I think by researching him you could trace his movements and this in turn may show what he was exposed to during his life. So he mAy have been an apprentice to a particular group of people which would teach him this code. Like as I think previously stated "the masons". If it's not be suggested I'll throw that out there as well. That those coded references are also masons and their details protected.

This is a fascinating puzzle but the two remote examples show a common source. Another clue. However have to agree with previous post - it does seem that he has robbed from various sources. But this points to adaptation on his part, or the masons as well. As like Christianity they robbed what came before and called it their own. Like scientology is doing today so the Christians did with paganism and a lot of paganism stems from Greek influence. The confusion caused may be due to seeing this, further down the time line, blend of symbolic technique.

[sunnylew]

I've had a look about for the Pastor, Samuel Say Toms.

Apparently he was the second or third generation of Dissenting ministers in his family. His father released a few books and some middling poetry.

He was pastor for something like 56 years in Framlingham, and was the one who declared the Framlingham Congregation as Unitarian (though I don't profess to know what that means - more to research later ).

In terms of his codes, I wonder whether their proximity to the date is the key.

On at least two occasions (one is below) he has actually put in the day and month but not the year before he has gone on to add a string of cipher. On at least one other occasion there has been no date at all - just name and cipher (also below), which seems odd given that this appears to be a list of when every member of his congregation joined.

And in every occasion the cipher is immediately following the date, which follows the name. Never does he say that so and so died "X", was removed on" X" - followed by code.

Astrology, perhaps? - it could be planets in houses etc

[Marmaduke 123]

What exactly is this register? it looks like a record of members who have left the church, either of their own accord or because they have been expelled. I've seen something similar but without the codes in a baptist church minute book, where there were a lot of references to expulsions because of immorality. I imagine the code describes exactly what form the immorality or bad behaviour took.

Anne

[sunnylew]

It's actually a list of people who had joined the Church since the pastor Samuel Say Toms took over. He lists them whether they have since been removed or not.

He may well be saying something scandalous about them - but he seems to use cod on people who have not been expelled as well. And in other places he does not mince his words.

My 5x Great Grandfather Nicholas Buckingham was expelled for drinking, repenting, and then drinking again. Pastor Toms quotes the bible when he speaks of sadly casting Nicholas out - "As the dog returns to its vomit ..."

[sargie]

I'm wondering whether the discovery of the Rosetta Stone had any influence - it was discovered in 1799, and first went on display in the British Museum in 1802.  Rev Toms started using code in 1807, so he could have read about it, or been to see it.

His symbols look similar to the demotic text on the stone.

[stenog]

Reviving a possibly ancient thread here. Just to put an end to some of the rather extravagant speculation, both the original shorthand snippets and the subsequent additional full-page post are almost certainly in one of the (many!) variants of one of Shelton's systems (Pepys and Isaac Newton were both users of Shelton's system. They were hugely popular at the time, and were used widely). Church officials were a significant market, because of the importance of the verbatim reporting of sermons. Subterfuge and shennanigens are, sadly, not a necessary corollary of shorthand usage.

That said, Shelton's systems (and others of the time), although well documented, take a bit of getting into, and I am a bit rusty. The problem is the vast number of so-called `arbitraries', signs which don't follow the rules, and which have to be looked up in any number of badly written, badly printed pamphlets and tutorials, many of which are still not available in electronic form. Shorthand writers of the time also seemed to relish the challenge of writing in the tiniest hand they could (Pepys being a signal offender). The full-page contribution to this thread is, however, a model of clarity (as far as such is possible!).

I'm hunting around for the correct versions of Shelton for these two conundra (they are probably not the same), and will post transcriptions when (if) I do.

Sean.

[sunnylew]

Finding out what script he actually used is great news!

Although it was fun imagining what could have been said, I'm all for learning what the real information is.

If you find a good crib for the version the Rev has used here, and it is online, would you mind posting the link?

There's plenty more code in those registers than that I've uploaded, and if I feel game in the future, it would be good to know how to go about transcribing the rest.