Author Topic: Code in a Non-Conformist Register  (Read 15241 times)

Offline sunnylew

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Code in a Non-Conformist Register
« on: Saturday 16 April 11 00:54 BST (UK) »
I was looking through the Framlingham Presbyterian Registers of the early 1800s and came across quite a lot of what seems to be some sort of coded script or shorthand.

It pops up here and there amongst regular script, and I can only think there was something that the pastor did not want somebody (the authorities?) to read.

Does anyone recognise the text as a particular form of code, or know of such things being linked to Presbyterians of the time?
Anything in Hethersett, Norfolk
Buckenham and Variants in Norfolk and Suffolk.
Goodlad in Suffolk.
Palmer in Birmingham

Offline anitah1972

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Re: Code in a Non-Conformist Register
« Reply #1 on: Saturday 16 April 11 03:37 BST (UK) »
How curious.  I can't help much, but to me some of the characters look vaguely like zodiac symbols, the dots and bars are a little reminiscent of the Freemason code, and googling shows images of Mary Queen of Scots cipher that (possibly only because it's also written with pen-and-ink) looks similar-ish.   

It could be the author's own invention, but if so, why use it in a register?  Who would/could read it?  If no one, then why bother writing it?

What, if anything do you know about the William Hill it's discussing? What's the context of the page?  Is this a biography?   

LEWNES/LIOUNIS from Greece, settled in Brooklyn, Kings, NYC, USA
ZBORAZ/SBORAI/SPORAY from Austria/Hungary/Czechoslovakia, settled in Pennsylvania, USA
GRAY from Galasheils/Hawick, Scotland
BAIN, SETH, GARDNER, DOUGLAS from Falkirk/Bo'ness/Linlithgow/Dumbarton, Scotland
MCGREGOR/MCGRIGOR/JARVIS from Scotland

Offline sunnylew

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Re: Code in a Non-Conformist Register
« Reply #2 on: Saturday 16 April 11 05:16 BST (UK) »
This is amongst a list of burials.

I know nothing more of William - but many more entries have the same symbols, sometimes only two or three of them amidst regular english characters. William's was the one that just had the greatest sample of the script.

I've attached another page for comparison.
Anything in Hethersett, Norfolk
Buckenham and Variants in Norfolk and Suffolk.
Goodlad in Suffolk.
Palmer in Birmingham

Offline Greensleeves

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Re: Code in a Non-Conformist Register
« Reply #3 on: Saturday 16 April 11 07:26 BST (UK) »
How very interesting. It looks like Pitman shorthand about 40 years before it was introduced!
Suffolk: Pearl(e),  Garnham, Southgate, Blo(o)mfield,Grimwood/Grimwade,Josselyn/Gosling
Durham/Yorkshire: Sedgwick/Sidgwick, Shadforth
Ireland: Davis
Norway: Torreson/Torsen/Torrison
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk


Offline Wiggy

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Re: Code in a Non-Conformist Register
« Reply #4 on: Saturday 16 April 11 07:28 BST (UK) »
That's what I was thinking GS - shorthand of some description! 

Very odd - and very very frustrating!!     We need some cipher breakers!   

Please, may we read a bit more about James the little boy who from infancy attended of his own accord . . . .  the first day he came . . . . . . .     ?     (I need a face for agog with curiosity!!)      What happened?

 that's very intriguing!     Just while we are trying to unlock the code you understand!!   ;)

Wiggy   :)
Gaunt, Ransom, McNally, Stanfield, Kimberley. (Tasmania)
Brown, Johnstone, Eskdale, Brand  (Dumfriesshire,  Scotland)
Booth, Bruerton, Deakin, Wilkes, Kimberley
(Warwicks, Staffords)
Gaunt (Yorks)
Percy, Dunning, Hyne, Grigg, Farley (Devon, UK)
Duncan (Fife, Devon), Hugh, Blee (Cornwall)
Green, Mansfield, (Herts)
Cavenaugh, Ransom (Middlesex)
 

 Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.

Offline Greensleeves

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Re: Code in a Non-Conformist Register
« Reply #5 on: Saturday 16 April 11 08:26 BST (UK) »
I agree Wiggy - more info on that little lad please!

I notice that in the first clip there is the symbol for 'female' so I am wondering whether the writer used his code sometimes for tittle-tattle.  If that is the case, what a shame that we shall never know what it  was!
Suffolk: Pearl(e),  Garnham, Southgate, Blo(o)mfield,Grimwood/Grimwade,Josselyn/Gosling
Durham/Yorkshire: Sedgwick/Sidgwick, Shadforth
Ireland: Davis
Norway: Torreson/Torsen/Torrison
Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline D Orris

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Re: Code in a Non-Conformist Register
« Reply #6 on: Saturday 16 April 11 09:22 BST (UK) »
Just a thought, is the Do after the name, as in Groom, short for ditto, so to say they are both from the same place.  Is it worth comparing William Hills entry to the one above it.
Notts - Allen, Barton, Morris, Preston, Sims
Yorks - Morris
Lincs - Floyd, Gowsell
Derbys - Barton, Sims
Worces - Floyd, Beddall/Biddle

Offline sargie

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Re: Code in a Non-Conformist Register
« Reply #7 on: Saturday 16 April 11 10:19 BST (UK) »
If you can find his name on the register, you may be able to find out more about him, and why he used a code.
There are books about historic Framlingham on Google Books which may mention him as well.

Offline Wiggy

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Re: Code in a Non-Conformist Register
« Reply #8 on: Saturday 16 April 11 11:28 BST (UK) »
  Which Framlingham are you talking about - is it in UK??
Gaunt, Ransom, McNally, Stanfield, Kimberley. (Tasmania)
Brown, Johnstone, Eskdale, Brand  (Dumfriesshire,  Scotland)
Booth, Bruerton, Deakin, Wilkes, Kimberley
(Warwicks, Staffords)
Gaunt (Yorks)
Percy, Dunning, Hyne, Grigg, Farley (Devon, UK)
Duncan (Fife, Devon), Hugh, Blee (Cornwall)
Green, Mansfield, (Herts)
Cavenaugh, Ransom (Middlesex)
 

 Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.