Author Topic: Leander Green  (Read 13380 times)

Offline Jane Masri

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Re: Leander Green
« Reply #27 on: Saturday 09 April 11 07:31 BST (UK) »
Yes Roy, this was a hard nut to crack  :) but very interesting,

Jane
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Online cath151

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Re: Leander Green
« Reply #28 on: Saturday 09 April 11 07:42 BST (UK) »
Yes really well done everyone, pity we can t pin down Leanders birth, how frustrating.
Cathy :)
Sinnock/Sinnicks...Brighton,Greenwich.
Clements,Coles,Mc Donagh,Rock

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Offline Roy G

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Re: Leander Green
« Reply #29 on: Saturday 09 April 11 16:08 BST (UK) »
Leander or Lydia's birth was perhaps one of the very few that actually was,
 'Under a Gooseberry Bush', or some other similar looking clump of rural vegetation!!!   Roy G

Offline Jane Masri

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Re: Leander Green
« Reply #30 on: Saturday 09 April 11 16:55 BST (UK) »
It's certainly beginning to look that way Roy  ::)  The only one that comes up is the Hearne one which must be Solomon's daughter & I've totally discounted that one as she appears on a separate page for 1901, so two Leander's around the same age both born Surrey.
I've been having loads of fun reading-up about London Romany gypsies especially those on Mitcham Common,

http://www.amazon.co.uk/LONDON-Gypsy-Mitcham-common-Surrey/dp/B0030IEUWI

http://concerttee.com/posters/posters.php?item=6811496

http://www.untoldlondon.org.uk/article/london039s-romany-gypsies

Someone has George & Harriet Gladwin on their tree on Ancestry.  They have Harriet down as Harriet Ann Cooper (1860-1931) Not sure how accurate this is but there were two Cooper families on Mitcham Common in 1881.
Jane
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Offline Roy G

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Re: Leander Green
« Reply #31 on: Saturday 09 April 11 18:47 BST (UK) »
I am now playing hunches which as you know are NOT fact, but they provide useful theories.
The 1881 census has: 
Gladwin    Mister    1859    Norwood    Croydon, Mitcham
Gladwin    Harriet    1860    Fulham Fields    Croydon, Mitcham     
Gladwin    Linda    1880    Mitcham    Croydon, Mitcham    
Gladwin    Joseph    1833    Norwood    Croydon, Mitcham
Gladwin    Mary    1841    London    Croydon, Mitcham
We know the first three and believe Linda could be Leander, but its the last two that interest me.  They are gathered together in the same place as families do and of an age and birthplace to be Mister (George) Gladwin's parents.       Thoughts please?           Roy G

Offline Roy G

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Re: Leander Green
« Reply #32 on: Saturday 09 April 11 19:11 BST (UK) »
Furthermore, I do not know which of the Romany sites you have been looking at, but the following messages from and to a Rosalind on a BBC Kent website from 4 years back might be also useful.

To  BRITT DIXIE....I don't think Leander is the correct spelling as it is a male name so it was most probably recorded wrongly...already found two different surnames for birth certificates...Gladwin and Gladman...the last one is a combination of two of her names!!!...she also used to deliver babies in the Portslade (Sussex) area during 1900 to 1940's and she would just sign with a cross...thank you again...rosalind hersee
and
For ROSALIND HERSEE .... there were quite a few GLADWIN'S living in the mitchum area try the parish records..because most romanies couldn't read or write it was down to whoever was filling the forms in to spell names as they heard them..this coupled with the way romanies spoke names were often recorded as different than they were,also you might find the same person listed on two or three occasions as something slightly different.so try lenda, linda, or leenda.   good luck britt
Tue Mar 27 19:27:17 2007

site    http://www.bbc.co.uk/kent/have_your_say/community/romany_voices_archive42.shtml

Rosalind has another entry on the My Brighton website where she writes about a Leonora (not Leander) Godsalve H Newman of Buckler Street and her 12 children

site    http://www.mybrightonandhove.org.uk/page_id__6191_path__0p114p126p1243p.aspx

Roy G

Offline Jane Masri

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Re: Leander Green
« Reply #33 on: Sunday 10 April 11 16:23 BST (UK) »
Hi Roy,
Yes, I would agree with you, that Joseph & Mary could well be the parents of George Gladwin.
It's driving me potty trying to find a birth or baptism record for Leander.
1881, 1891 & 1901 suggests 1880.
1911 suggests 1877.
Marriage in 1931 suggests 1876.
Death in 1947 suggests 1874.
 ::)  Jane  ::)
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Offline Roy G

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Re: Leander Green
« Reply #34 on: Sunday 10 April 11 17:39 BST (UK) »
Hi Jane. 
Had this been the more run of the mill family, we would take the age of the eldest child and look for a marriage either side of that year.  Alternatively, we would find the marriage and look for the eldest child's birth either side of that date.  But this is not a run of the mill family and therefore breaks all of the rules.  So a marriage as we know it may or may not have taken place and although births happened, in all probability, registration or a baptism of that child may not have been done either.  So unless 'L' or a sibling conforms to civil or ecclesiastical protocol at some stage, or transgresses the law in some way, you are left to speculate. 

I have applied a little logic but that too is based on some speculation.  Firstly we have to know if the  Linda found on the 1881 census is the person sought ? (otherwise its a waste of time) If that is her, even the most simple of enumerators should be able to deduce the growth differences between a hardly walking and possibly still breast fed 1 year old and a rampaging five year old that is already undertaking simple domestic chores, so a birth year nearer to 1880 should be more acceptable.    Roy G

Offline Jane Masri

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Re: Leander Green
« Reply #35 on: Sunday 10 April 11 18:31 BST (UK) »
My own thoughts exactly Roy.  The age on the 1881 census is going to be the most likely to be correct as is the next one, 1891, when one of her parents gave her age.  She seems to have got it right in 1901 when she's a young adult with Alfred but after that it all goes to pot  ;)

Jane
Census information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Researching BRABY/BRAVERY in SURREY and SUSSEX

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