Missing Birth Records, Liverpool

[genjan1953]

Hello, I'm wondering whether anyone can suggest reasons why I can't find any birth records in the indexes online for all but two of these people, all born, apparently, in Liverpool between 1867 and 1889.

The parents are William ISAAC and Mary Ellen (nee BLUNDELL), my great grandparents, and they married on 26 Jun 1867 in Liverpool.  I know that they had 13 children two of whom had died by 1911, I don't know which two died though yet!  From all the relevant Census records, I've identified 10 children, as follows:

George       born abt. 1867 in Liverpool
Elizabeth    born abt. 1870  ditto
Ellen Jane   born abt. 1873  ditto
Samuel       born abt. 1875  ditto
William       born  abt. 1878  ditto
Forest Linaker   born 24 Mar 1880 Everton  (found a Christening on Ancestry)
Margaret    born  abt 1885   Liverpool
Harold        born  abt 1886   Liverpool
Sidney       born  abt 1887    Liverpool
Arthur       born abt. 1889     West Derby   (found FreeBMD entry)  My Grandfather

I've checked the FreeBMD and LDS indexes and also the LancashireBMD site for the whole of Lancashire and I can only find entries for Forest and Arthur.  Is this something to do with county boundaries?  Forgive my ignorance here, I'm a Southerner and not familiar with the northern counties of England    Even so though, I can't fathom why I can't find any possible entries except for the two I've indicated.  Any ideas for cracking this would be very welcome, thanks 

Janet

 

[junev]

Hi,

Can see some that might fit West Derby registration area

Harold Q1 1886 8b page 483
Sidney Q1 1887 8b p351
William Waller Q1 1878 8b 396

there is also a Mary Margaret Q3 1884 8b 369

Junev

[genjan1953]

Many thanks for that junev, they look like likely suspects!  I don't know how I came to miss those, possibly because I was searching on Ancestry's general birth records instead of going direct to the FreeBMD records.  It threw up so many offerings that my brain got befuddled!  I was hoping to retrieve some Christening/Bap records but no such luck.  I've found possibles for Ellen Jane and Elizabeth now as well. 

George and Samuel are proving a little more tricky since the possible entries for them are somewhat wide of the mark date-wise.  For example, Samuel is stated as age 6 on the 1881 Census, ie. born about 1875, and yet there are no birth entries within 3 years of that date.  Either the Enumerator got that wrong or the birth index entry is just missing.  I'll have to do some lateral thinking there I reckon.  Similar problem with George who is stated as 14 on the 1881 Census but there are no birth records which remotely match that either.  Oh well, maybe I'll leave George and Samuel for another time!

[ScouseBoy]

What you have to remember is that  the current boundary of the city of Liverpool   does NOT  follow exactly the 19th century boundary of Liverpool registration district.       The West Derby registration district covered a large area including districts of what we now think of as Liverpool.    West Derby covered most of Bootle and all of Crosby.

[genjan1953]

Thanks for that ScouseBoy, I'll bear that in mind as I'm searching.  My mum's family, on her Dad's side, all lived in the Liverpool area throughout the 19th Century and further back too, it seems.  As I've never been there and know little of the area, I thought I'd better gen up - found some good sites and learnt quite a bit already.  The geography does confuse me though so any info is helpful on that score! 

One thing, for example, is .... and this is going to sound really daft to many of you ..... but why is/was that particular district called 'West Derby', including the Liverpool area, when it's in Lancashire not Derbyshire?  I'm sure someone wil put me right!      

[ScouseBoy]

The Earl of Derby  had a large estate  in the area between   Prescot and St. Helens.    I am slightly hazy on it now,  but I think one entrance to that estate was near the village centre of  West Derby village.

If you are interested in looking on a map, look for the A580  (East Lancashire Road)   between  Kirkby  and St Helens.     To the south of the A580  is a large country estate,  probably with a hall at the centre of it.

[geniecolgan]

Add these to the pile,

George Alfred, Dec, 1870, W. Derby, 8b,233
Ellen Jane, Dec,1872, Liverpool, 8b,188
Margaret, Mar, 1876, W. Derby, 8b, 269

[ScouseBoy]

Thats very interesting.   I notice you have ancestors from Norfolk  and Buckinghamshire.    I have a Nursall  born in Buckinghamshire, and an  Avies ( or Aveis)   born Norfolk  1834,  who both moved to Liverpool and married into my family.

[genjan1953]

Thanks geniecolgan!  I'll look at those, I think Margaret, b.1876, is probably not her though.  More likely to be junev's Mary Margaret, b.1884.  Helpful though, thanks.

Scouseboy thanks, I'll investigate those details further - I like looking at maps!  I'd like to dig deeper into the history of the area, it'll give me a much better idea of my ancestors' lives, how and where they lived, rather than simply having a list of names and dates that don't really mean much.

My Norfolk and Bucks ancestors are on my father's line, whereas the Liverpool bunch are all on my mother's so there isn't a link there as with your own - well not that I've found so far anyway.  Mum's dad and his family were all in Liverpool, mum's mum's family were in Manchester so there are obviously connections there.  I've yet to explore the Manchester lot - apparently they were all in the Cotton Manufacturing trade so that should be intriguing too!