Irish Sailors and Soldiers Land Trust dublin houses

[gnikdivad]

Hi Keith, yes I certainly do have a picture. I got it from kew. I can email a copy of it to you if you like.  Your surname really rings a bell with me. I must ask my mam, I'm pretty sure she will know some of your family!
I'd love to help you in anyway I can so send me a private message and we can chat further.
David.

[pidgeoni38]

Hi David, I was trying to  send you a private message but apparently I have to comment on three threads to prove that I am not spam before I can send a message. I'm just looking for some leads for genealogy. Keith

[maryland001]

Hi does anyone know if his organisation is still in existence ?. I'm having problems trying to sort out my aunts title to the freehold of her house in Dublin as she can't find the deeds and looking at the land registry it says this organisation owns the freehold and she owns a 99 year lease. We thought this organisation was wound up, so how could they still own it ?

Any help greatly appreciated as this is holding up her move to a care home (which sounds awful but it is what she wants).

[ourgang]

Have a look at this Citizens advice site. your aunt has a 99 year leasehold interest in the property. She probably paid ground rent to a ground landlord...maybe she has not had a demand in years. Investigate the possibility of purchasing the ground rent. Maybe she did this in 1978 ( as many of us did) and never registered the vesting certificate...try to jog her memory.

http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/housing/owning_a_home/home_owners/ground_rent.html

I am not up to speed on present day arrangements but, it can be simple enough and you won't need a solicitor.
I just saw where you cannot locate the deeds. Did she have a loan from a Building Society if so they would have held the deeds and she may have forgotten to retrieve them when the purchase was finalised.

[maryland001]

Hi Ourgang, what a great name !...what I have so far is that there was a mortgage taken out in 1957 between irish permanent and my grandmother/mum this I presume was to pay for the lease (so maybe this is why they never paid ground rent, as they paid a lump sum up front ?), then in 1973 mum's came off a she was in the uk and my aunts name went on to the lease as she had come home for good. Then there are letters between her solicitor and irish perm around 1977 in which title deeds are mentioned and then another lot in a similar vein in 1982.

I've been over and went to land registry and registry of deeds and all they have is the lease. I can only think you may be right in that it wasn't registered and has been lost. I can see on your link that you can go through a process to do an affidavit for lost certs, so maybe after I've written to the world and has uncle and still cant find it...this is what I'll have to do. So worried so she will be just stuck  in transitory care for ages while I try to sort this out...not helped by me being in the UK !

Just a quick question if you or anyone else can help.

Who is irish permanent now, is it Permanent TSB ?

[maryland001]

Sorry just another question...will the document actually be called a vesting certificate or could it be called something else and would it just be one document or several. One of my sneaky fears is that I have actually seen it in her papers and don't recognise what it is .....

I've have asked my aunt about all this but the problem is she's 85, very unsettled where she is so I cant really get any sense out of her and now it's just becoming a really upsetting topic so I cant really mention it all without floods of tears. All my mum remembers is the 1957/1973 thing...she was so shocked when I said she's signed a lease..

What a bummer eh...such a b****y mess,

[ourgang]

Irish life and permanent is the name now
The company is historically derived from three different companies:

Irish Life Assurance
Irish Permanent Building Society
Trustee Savings Bank
It trades under the names:

Irish Life for life assurance, investments and pensions
Permanent TSB for banking, mortgages, loans, credit and debit cards.
They should have a file for the mortgage. I was surprised recently when I went into another Building society and they had a reecord of a mortgage i got over 40 yrs ago.

The vesting certificate is a very non descript one sheet piece of paper...I almost discarded mine in an 80's in a clean up.
Don't worry about people calling your aunt's ownership a lease...most property in Ireland was sold leasehold with a peppercorn rent. that is why in about 1978 the Act was passed to allow people buy out the ground rent and own the fee simple. I am out of touch with legal matters since I retired but, I would say the lease held by the Registry of Deeds should be sufficient title to enable you sell the house.
Another thought...have you contacted the Solicitors mentioned in 1977 and 1982..they might have the title documents.