Author Topic: Any ideas/info about this photo please?  (Read 5485 times)

Offline ogohogoh

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Re: Any ideas/info about this photo please?
« Reply #27 on: Sunday 16 January 11 18:56 GMT (UK) »
It looks more like a whip than a lead in his right hand...although it appears rather worn, possibly chewed.  He's holding a single glove in his gloved left hand. 

PS. I note that you have an interest in Brightlingsea - his bride was from a well-known family of fish merchants in Brightlinsea, the Tabors.

Offline IgorStrav

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Re: Any ideas/info about this photo please?
« Reply #28 on: Sunday 16 January 11 19:01 GMT (UK) »
Have just been able to look at the entry for the marriage between Henry Richard Wilkinson and Clara Jane Mostran, and I must say there are a couple of details which do seem to link it well with the licensed victualler reference

The marriage was on September 10th in St Stephen's Parish Church Lambeth.

Henry Richard Wilkinson was aged 22, a grocer's assistant, of 35 Dorset Road, Lambeth, and his father was John Wilkinson, a butler
Clara Jane Mostran was aged 23, no occupation, of 1 Osborne Cottages, Dorset Road, Lambeth, and her father was Edward Balls Mostran, a herbalist.

Unfortunately, their son William H E Wilkinson (from the 1891 Census China turned up), doesn't show up in the London Christening records, which would confirm his father's occupation at the time of his birth in Lambeth in 1887.  

Still not sure of them all in either the 1901 or the 1911.
Pay, Kent. 
Barham, Kent. 
Cork(e), Kent. 
Cooley, Kent.
Barwell, Rutland/Northants/Greenwich.
Cotterill, Derbys.
Van Steenhoven/Steenhoven/Hoven, Nord Brabant/Belgium/East London.
Kesneer Belgium/East London
Burton, East London.
Barlow, East London
Wayling, East London
Wade, Greenwich/Brightlingsea, Essex.
Thorpe, Brightlingsea, Essex

Offline IgorStrav

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Re: Any ideas/info about this photo please?
« Reply #29 on: Sunday 16 January 11 19:04 GMT (UK) »
Oh yes, you're right, Fred, I can see now that he's wearing a glove on his left hand and holding the other glove in it.  Looks like the dog's been chewing the lead/whip!  ;)

I would say he's about 10 in the photo, putting it 1897.
Pay, Kent. 
Barham, Kent. 
Cork(e), Kent. 
Cooley, Kent.
Barwell, Rutland/Northants/Greenwich.
Cotterill, Derbys.
Van Steenhoven/Steenhoven/Hoven, Nord Brabant/Belgium/East London.
Kesneer Belgium/East London
Burton, East London.
Barlow, East London
Wayling, East London
Wade, Greenwich/Brightlingsea, Essex.
Thorpe, Brightlingsea, Essex

Offline ogohogoh

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Re: Any ideas/info about this photo please?
« Reply #30 on: Sunday 16 January 11 19:14 GMT (UK) »
It's great that we've found his father and mother...but William still seems almost as illusive in death as in life...and I've no idea why my father made virtually no reference to him in his lifetime.  It's a great pity that I didn't ask more questions...but I guess we all have those regrets when we reach a certain age.  Somehow it only seems to matter when it's too late  :(


Offline ogohogoh

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Re: Any ideas/info about this photo please?
« Reply #31 on: Sunday 16 January 11 19:23 GMT (UK) »
Hi Igor?

What year were Henry Richard Wilkinson and Clara Jane Mostran married?

Offline chinakay

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Re: Any ideas/info about this photo please?
« Reply #32 on: Sunday 16 January 11 19:25 GMT (UK) »
September quarter of 1883. You can look it up at FBMD.
Moore/Paterson~Montreal
Moore/Addison~New Brunswick
Jubb/Kerr~Mirfield~Halifax~Moffatt
Williams~Dolwyddelan

King~Bedfordshire~Hull
Jenkins~Somerset
Sellers~Hull

Offline IgorStrav

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Re: Any ideas/info about this photo please?
« Reply #33 on: Sunday 16 January 11 19:27 GMT (UK) »
Oh yes, I can empathise with that one.  All the people you COULD have asked, and didn't.

On the other hand, many of them wouldn't have told you much, and lots of them would have passed on somewhat garbled memories.  That's what we all say here.  ::)

I've found Lilian Maud Tabor in the 1911 living at 32 Beecholm Road, Clapton.  The family have a lodger living with them, and, reading between the lines, I bet that's how Lilian (a dressmaker) and William Henry E Wilkinson (a stockbroker's clerk) met.

I've tried to see if I can see William in the 1911 in Clapton or thereabouts, but no luck currently.

The thing is, of course, that many marriages weren't happy and, unlike today, you couldn't just divorce and move on.  So people did leave.  

You may have to content yourself with putting as much meat on the bones of William's family as you can, and resign yourself to not being able to track down much about the man himself.  Unfortunately there are rather a lot of William Wilkinsons in the WWI records, and beyond those, tracking people in the 20th century is very difficult.

On the other hand, didn't you say that Lilian DID marry later, so it may be worthwhile looking for William's death around the time of the marriage, as perhaps she did know vaguely where he was, or was told about it?


oh, sorry, re the marriage, told you everything else about it, but the year! 1883!

Have also found Clara Jane Mostran's christening records, parents shown as Edward Balls Mostran and Frances Jane Clark Mostran.  Edward's a porter in 1860, rather than a herbalist.
Pay, Kent. 
Barham, Kent. 
Cork(e), Kent. 
Cooley, Kent.
Barwell, Rutland/Northants/Greenwich.
Cotterill, Derbys.
Van Steenhoven/Steenhoven/Hoven, Nord Brabant/Belgium/East London.
Kesneer Belgium/East London
Burton, East London.
Barlow, East London
Wayling, East London
Wade, Greenwich/Brightlingsea, Essex.
Thorpe, Brightlingsea, Essex

Offline ogohogoh

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Re: Any ideas/info about this photo please?
« Reply #34 on: Sunday 16 January 11 20:43 GMT (UK) »
Eight years after my father's birth his mother Lilian Maud had a daughter by another man on 24th Dec 1922, and although they never married he became stepfather to my father.  I believed the couple  lived happily together until his death whenever that was...and she eventually remarried in March 1941...to a man my father introduced her to.   I can only assume that she was not free to marry her second partner during his lifetime.

As an aside I have this from my cousin - the elder son of Lilian Maud's daughter

"By the way did you hear the story of Nan (Lilian Maud) being on the stage with Houdini - the glamorous assistant - when he performed in the UK (presumably London)? According to stories I was told she was also the first woman to ride a motorcycle through the streets of London. And then there are the stories about the club in Soho and her 'relationship' with the so-called 'King of Soho'. All good stuff to pass onto our kids/grandkids - Nan was somewhat special. By the way, your info about the Tabors being in the fish business explains why Nan also had a fish stall at Billingsgate at some time (so I was told)." 

She had a number of soho night/drinking clubs...as did my father (I have a list).

Offline IgorStrav

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Re: Any ideas/info about this photo please?
« Reply #35 on: Sunday 16 January 11 21:21 GMT (UK) »
Gosh - well, those are some memories.

Lilian was a dressmaker in 1911, aged 24, and married two years later, having your father the following year.  Perhaps she slotted in being Houdini's assistant ahead of that?

Or, conceivably, and no disrespect to your family memories whatsoever, she attended one of Houdini's performances during the first decade of the 20th Century (he toured the UK then) and said to someone "ooh, if he asked ME to be his glamorous assistant, I'd be up there like a shot"  ;)
Pay, Kent. 
Barham, Kent. 
Cork(e), Kent. 
Cooley, Kent.
Barwell, Rutland/Northants/Greenwich.
Cotterill, Derbys.
Van Steenhoven/Steenhoven/Hoven, Nord Brabant/Belgium/East London.
Kesneer Belgium/East London
Burton, East London.
Barlow, East London
Wayling, East London
Wade, Greenwich/Brightlingsea, Essex.
Thorpe, Brightlingsea, Essex