Help needed finding a needle in a haystack.

[Annie65115]

Henry Broadwood m  Frances Lowther 1840

Now in 1851, Henry Broadwood, Member of Parliament, was living with his wife Frances, young son Arthur and the usual servants, in Tunbridge Wells. In Frances, Henry had married a younger woman - but her dob would have been around 1819, so she could not have been having children in the 1870s under any guise.

However, in another headache-inducing coincidence, their second (first? what were parliamentary rules in those days? haha!) home was in Argyll St in London, in a house that had previously been home to Chevalier George de Benkhausen, Russian consul!!!

[Braindead]

However, in another headache-inducing coincidence, their second (first? what were parliamentary rules in those days? haha!) home was in Argyll St in London, in a house that had previously been home to Chevalier George de Benkhausen, Russian consul!!!

It all seems very incestuous / nepotistic!

As an aside, going back to the orignal (?) Mary Broadwood, in the 1861 census she gave her age as 25 i.e. born somewhere around 1836, yet in the marriage register for her wedding to Charles in 1854 she is described as of full age i.e. born in 1833 or earlier. I know it's only a small difference but I think it illustrates how careless the lady was with facts about herself.

[Braindead]

The latest installment...

Just received the birth certificate of Hélène - the name on the certificate is the Anglicised Helen Margaret by the way, but the really interesing part, as may be supposed is the mother's name:

Mary Broadwood formally HAMILTON 

This, of course set me thinking -

In her daughter's marriage banns in France she's Marie Broadwood Tourmaly Hamilton

The image looks like Tormaly or Formaly: I was wondering if it was just a misunderstood 'formerly'

I think that's the case - if Hélène just gave her birth certificate when registering for her marriage in Paris then the person completing the banns may just have copied the name.  Thanks for that Tati. 

Then I got to thinking further, that as the certificates I have are from the copied register rather than the original, could there have been a transcription error when copying the original: there are some similarities in the letter formations of Hamilton & Lowther when written in script.

Where does this leave me now, and where do I go from here?

I am, of course, much further on thanks to the Rootschat community - less than a month ago I had no definite knowledge of the daughter's births or Frances Mary's marriage - you've helped me find them so huge thanks. 

On all three certificates, Mary goes by her married name of Broadwood, but it's variously Hamilton, Lowther, or nothing entered.

My instinct is that Mary WAS the wife of Charles Broadwood, used his middle name of Hamilton to suit her and that Lowther, on Tatiana's birth certificate is a mis-transcription.

Any more thoughts to help me along?
 

[Annie65115]

Do you have any more info about Mary/Marie/Frances's death?

--edited to add--

Charles Broadwood made a will, details of which are on the national probate calendar (I got this through Ancestry). As his divorce had been refused, he was still technically married to Mary at the time of his death, so I assume his will may make reference to her, even if it's only to say that she gets nothing!

For the sake of a fiver, and if it were me, I'd send away for a copy and see if there are any more clues to be gained from it. Probably not- but you never know ----

[Braindead]

I haven't sent off for The will as I don't think it will help. There were two more court cases involving the Broadwoods. In 1870 Mary went to court and got a restraining order against Charles, stopping him from taking any of her assets, And in 1874, she challenged Charles' Will - unsuccessfully, with costs being awarded against her.It is interesting To note that, if she was the same person, she would have been pregnant with Helene at the time of this challenge. I don't know anything about her death,except that it was before Helene's marriage. I suspect it was a long time before, due to the girls being put in a convent by the time of the 1891 census. A newspaper report at the end of 1882 shows that Michel was relieved of the post of minister to Japan at his own request and I wonder if Mary's death was the reason for this request?

[Annie65115]

I was just thinking that if you were really, really lucky, the will may refer to "my estranged wife Mary aka Maria/Frances and currently shacking up with a certain Russian" -- or words to that effect!

[Braindead]

"my estranged wife Mary aka Maria/Frances and currently shacking up with a certain Russian"

   

As you've put it like that, I can see the benefit of the outlay, especially as I was going to send off for Michel's will next.

[davidbraidwood]

I have been fascinated by this thread.
I hope that you are still active.
I research all Broadwoods and because of that I was aware of the marriage of Charles Hamilton Broadwood to Mary (Ann/Louisa) Short, but knew nothing of her subsequent life.
I have recently been collaborating with a descendant of the Short family and that got me looking again at Mary Ann Short. I am fascinated by all her possible aliases.

Do you have any new information that is not in the thread.
For instance I believe that I have a record of her death.
I hope to hear from you.
David

[Annie65115]

Yes, it has been fascinating to read through it again! I notice we were posting on Xmas day, I’m not sure how I got away with that- the OH must have been immersed in the TV!

I too would love to hear if the story has been taken any further.