Author Topic: Lady Ann of Clontarf?  (Read 83424 times)

Offline despair

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Re: Lady Ann of Clontarf?
« Reply #243 on: Tuesday 01 December 15 17:40 GMT (UK) »
Season's greetings to you too,Joe.Good luck with the nudging,particularly the portrait de-framing.

Regards
Roger

Offline Joseph L. Oliver

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Re: Lady Ann of Clontarf?
« Reply #244 on: Wednesday 06 January 16 08:06 GMT (UK) »
Hello All, and happy new year.  Hope everyone is doing well.

I'm am very, VERY excited to post this entry.

About a month ago I wrote up a summary of the Lady Anne saga for the appraiser who my cousin will (hopefully) submit the portrait to.  In going over all of your and my research and forming the summary, I became quite certain on who Lady Anne most likely is, and speculated on how she might be related.  I withheld sharing that summary with you all, because, without any supporting data from appraisal of the portrait, it was pure speculation.

Well, my cousin and I have yet to connect with the appraiser, BUT……

Today I received a reply from my most recent inquiry to the Archdiocese of Cincinnati, and my judgement is that it all but confirms my speculation on how Lady Anne is related to James Francis Burke.  All I can say for now is that it all centers on James Burke's singular insistence, throughout almost all of the historical records (census, directories, etc,) that he include his middle initial. 

I know it's cruel to hold back at this point, but I must wait a few days to share this information while I do a little more digging around the record from the Archdiocese to make sure of the connection. 

If you'll allow, my first bit of digging is this question:  for years I've wondered why one of the two baptismal  records I've had (in Latin from St. Xavier Church) for James and Jessie's kids (Mary Hellen and John James) shows the mother as "Maria":
  • Mary Hellen 1855:  mother Jessie Sudderland (father Jacob Burk)
  • John James 1861 mother Maria Sudderland (father Jacob Burke)

Anyone have an idea why this is so?  Is Maria sometimes substituted for Jessie in Latin church records?  BTW, I am 100% certain due to corroborating records that the baptism records are of the same couple.

I will try to post or attach the month-old summary later on in the day.  It's very late.

Regards,

Joe
Burke, Sutherland, Curtis, Cuter, Koplik

Offline despair

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Re: Lady Ann of Clontarf?
« Reply #245 on: Thursday 07 January 16 08:34 GMT (UK) »
A tantalising prospect,Joe.Unfortunately,I can't answer your question.I'm only aware that Jessie is used as a form of Jane or Janet which would,I think,be Jana or Johanna.I'm sure there are plenty more people better qualified to answer your question,and let's hope they respond.How critical is it to your proposed solution?

Regards
Roger

Offline MonicaL

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Re: Lady Ann of Clontarf?
« Reply #246 on: Thursday 07 January 16 16:57 GMT (UK) »
Hi All

Happy New Year to you all too from me  :)

This is a great website for first name variants www.whatsinaname.net/female-names/Jessie.html

Monica
Census information Crown Copyright, www.nationalarchives.gov.uk


Offline Joseph L. Oliver

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Re: Lady Ann of Clontarf?
« Reply #247 on: Friday 08 January 16 02:04 GMT (UK) »
Well, actually, yesterday I asked the same question of the researcher at the Archdiocese of Cincy, and she said she gets similar questions quite often.  She said it seems that some priests seem to have entered records long after the ceremonies had taken place, and simply forgotten names.  She said one particular priest simply entered "Mary" for every female.
Burke, Sutherland, Curtis, Cuter, Koplik

Offline Joseph L. Oliver

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Re: Lady Ann of Clontarf?
« Reply #248 on: Friday 08 January 16 03:52 GMT (UK) »
Oh, Roger, sorry:  I was asking the question in order to get perspective on the new record I obtained from the Archdiocese:  except for "Maria" as the woman's first name, all the other pertinent data indicates the couple as James and Jessie. 
Burke, Sutherland, Curtis, Cuter, Koplik

Offline Joseph L. Oliver

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Re: Lady Ann of Clontarf?
« Reply #249 on: Friday 08 January 16 16:11 GMT (UK) »
Okay, I'm attempting to attach the summary as a PDF.  The final two pages may seem like a work of fiction but please put aside all the red flags until you let it sink in a bit.  "Once you eliminate the impossible, whatever remains, no matter how improbable, must be the truth." - Arthur Conan Doyle
Burke, Sutherland, Curtis, Cuter, Koplik

Offline despair

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Re: Lady Ann of Clontarf?
« Reply #250 on: Friday 08 January 16 16:51 GMT (UK) »
Attachment downloaded OK-just about to read.I'll let it sink in and comment tomorrow.

Regards
Roger

Offline hallmark

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Re: Lady Ann of Clontarf?
« Reply #251 on: Friday 08 January 16 16:58 GMT (UK) »
At this stage I haven't a clue at who to look for!! 
Give a man a record and you feed him for a day.
Teach a man to research, and you feed him for a lifetime.