HAVELOCK Thomas and Margaret in Sunderland 1790-1851

[tonyvant]

I am trying to connect our tree (Tate-Dittmer-Sanderson) to the Havelocks, especially establishing the relationship, if any, to Sir Henry Havelock b 5 apr 1795 d 24 Nov 1857.

I have a reasonable view of this from both ends but cannot get them to join around 1800-1825.

Our family leads back to Barbara Havelock born in Monkwearmouth 26 April 1827, with parents Thomas and Margaret Havelock (from IGI).

On the 1841 census Barbara, aged 14, is at Monkwearmouth Shore with Thomas Havelock aged 42. This Thomas then appears to marry Ursula Turnbull and has another family as in the 1851 and 1861 census.

Cannot pin down which Thomas Havelock he is on those that I have found in the Havelock tree to date nor which Margaret.

I have found likely marriages to a Margaret Knotcher 5 July 1820 Sunderland and a Margaret Oliver 17 June 1820 Sunderland although she had another child baptised just prior to Barbara's birth. There is also an older marriage to Margaret Charlton on 24 Apr 1791 but that seems a long time before Barbara's birth.

Can anyone provide these missing links.

Thanks

[briann1]

hi tonyvant  did your barbara havelock marry thomas tate in 1848. in christ church sunderland.  If so i have a bit of a family tree i could send you about her parents and g.parents
regards briann

[2zpool]

Children baptised to Thomas and Margaret Havelock in Monkwearmouth St. Peter:

Margaret  21 Mar 1819
Elizabeth  8 Apr 1821, born 29 Jan 1821, Shore, Joiner
Thomas  14 Aug 1825, born Jul 21 1825, Shore, Joiner
Barbara  20 May 1827, born 26 Apr, Shore, Joiner
Isabella Jane  1 June 1834, burial Isabella Jane, age 1 yr 6 mo, 11 Feb 1835

Marriage Monkwearmouth St. Peter:  Thomas Havelock and Margaret Ryder 31 Dec 1817. One witness was Thomas Havelock sr.  the other I couldn't read very well.  You can see this on the Bishop's Transcripts 495 of 788

Burial Margaret Havelock, Monkwearmouth Shore, age 39, 14 May 1837, also burial of 5 wk old John Thomas Havelock, same day (the Bishop's transcripts says age 5 but my parish trascript says 5 weeks)

I don't know if these provide any missing links.  

Janis

[tonyvant]

Thank you both.

Brian - yes Barbara Havelock married Thomas Tate in 1848 please let me have the piece of tree.

Janis - thanks for all of this, been working on parts of this.

Thanks

[tonyvant]

Hi,

I have had time to work through all the info you have both sent me and it has been a great help.

I now know where Barbara Havelock fits in more detail and have many more pointers to tie her in to Sir Henry.

Not there yet but getting there.

Thanks

Tony

[havers]

Hi

Imay have an answer for you, as I am related to Henry, through his grandfather who was called William. William had a brother called George who married Sarah Walker and they had a son called Thomas who married Sarah Brown. Thomas married Margaret Notcher in 1824 in Sunderland and according to mt recorsd only had two children Eleonar born 1829 and sarah born in 1834. This is not ho0wever conclusive  and I shall consult with someone elese I know, who may be able to check the details.

Eatch this space

Mike Havelock

[tonyvant]

Mike,

Thank you for this, any help in proving or disproving a link is a great help.  Was the Grandfather William's, brother George, a Clockmaker in Guisborough?

We are still looking to see if or where the Barbara Havelock in our tree meets Sir Henry Havelock's tree.

Briann1 shared a piece of tree with us, as below, but we have not tied this into our understanding of Sir Henry's tree or as yet found all the associated   parish records. We suspect he may be the son of one of William and George's siblings or from an earlier generation – if at all.

The Barbara Havelock's tree we are currently working with is:

Thomas Havelock (1754-1836), married 1791 at Woodhorn to, Margaret Charlton (1763-1825)

Children:
Michael Havelock (1791-1828)
Jane Havelock (1793-1862)
Elizabeth Havelock (1796-)
Thomas Havelock (1797-1867) continues below
Margaret Havelock (1800-)
John Havelock (1802-)
Phyllis Havelock (1803-)
Sarah Havelock (1806-)

Thomas Havelock (1797-1867) married three times

1 Margaret Ryder (1798-1837) married 31 Dec 1817 St Peter's Monkwearmouth
Children:
Margaret Havelock (1819-)
Elizabeth Havelock (1821-)
Thomas Havelock (1825-)
Barbara Havelock (1827-1894) who went on to marry Thomas Tate and our tree
Isabella Jane Havelock (1833-1835)
John Thomas Havelock (1837-1837)

2 Elizabeth Grant (-1840) married 1839

3 Ursula Turnbull (1819-1890) married 1841
Children:
Thomas Havelock (1843-1914)
Jane Ann Havelock (1845-1852)
Michael William Havelock (1847-1882)

The 1841 census has

Whitburn Street, Monkwearmouth Shore

Thomas Havelock, 42, joiner
Jane Grant, 19, dressmaker
Barbara Havelock, 14

The problem we have had is ensuring we have the correct Margaret (Notcher, Oliver or Charlton) as Barbara's mother.

Thanks

Tony

[briann1]

Hi tony looking through the messages again I began to wonder why would Thomas Havelock  while married to Ursular name one of his children Thomas in 1843, when he already had a son Thomas to his 1st wife Margaret Rider in 1825. But I have just been on Durham records online and the Thomas born 1825 died aged 9 months in Monkwearmouth on 7/5/1826 so that seems to clear up a doubt I had
You may already have this info but I had to check

[tonyvant]

Thanks briann1

We had missed that too so again most helpful.

You haven't by chance progressed backwards from Thomas Havelock born 1754 have you?

Thanks again

Tony