Embarrassing lack of knowledge

[mrsspen]

I am really embarrassed to admit this but I have such a poor poor knowledge of WW1 that I'm struggling to piece my Great Grandfathers last movements etc together. Can anyone help..

His name was William Charles Bampton number S/20407
I've found his war grave details, medal card but no service records. The war grave shows that he is remembered on the Thiepval Memorial. That he was a private in 1st battalion riflebrigade. I deduce from the war grave then that he evidently died in the battle of the somme (oct 1916). But is that the extent of what I can find out?

Is there anywhere else I can look for details on the battalions movements etc..its all quite confusing when you are a novice?

[gortonboy]

HI,,This site tells you that the ist battalion rifle brigade were part of the 4th division,,,,once you click the link,and read about the rifle brigade,,if u scroll down,,you can click on the "4th division",,this tells you more.

http://www.1914-1918.net/rb.htm

[gortonboy]

clicking on the 4th division tells you that of 2 battles that the 4th division were involved in,,,,the one that fits the date is the battle of le transloy

http://www.cwgc.org/somme/content.asp?menuid=30&id=30&menuname=Le%20Transloy&menu=main

[lizb]

http://www.greenjackets-net.org.uk/rb/branch.htm
http://www.armymuseums.org.uk/museums/0000000097-Royal-Green-Jackets-Museum.htm
http://www2.armynet.mod.uk/museums/rifles_museums/winchester_museum/research.htm

First I would hunt around on the internet to look for someone who know about what this regiment did in the war. Then I would look to see if any reocrds office or museum has the relevant war diaries.

If you had his service record it would provide physical description and when he was in France but not details of where he was or what he did. Details of what his unit did will be in the war diaries.

I am speaking as a 'non-expert' who knew my grandfather's regiment and service number and was very lucky to find a link on the regiment website to someone who had followed up what that regiment did in the war. They were able to identify what unit he was with and where that unit was at particular times.

This is quite a quick reply as I am on my way out but I thought I would write as I find this sort of follow up so interesting and there is such a lot you can do on the internet. I had a quick  'google' and there are loads of links for the rifle brigade

Good luck
lizb

[BumbleB]

If anyone is interested I have a copy of "The West Yorkshire Regiment in the War" pages 282 - 285, which covers the Le Sars and Flers Line from 4 October to 11 October 1916 and part of the attack on Mild and Cloudy trenches on 12 October - my grandfather died on 7 October at Le Sars along with 216 other ranks and 8 officers from 11the Battalion, West Yorkshire Regiment. 

BumbleB

[mrsspen]

Thank you for such comprehansive replies. I am truly awful at military history etc and all the numbers/divisions battalions confuses me greatly. I did read a lot of wilfred owen when i was younger so I had a fair idea on the war but this bit baffles me. Its embarrasing.

I've had a look at all of the info posted above and le transloy fits the dates etc but I cant find the 4th division listed in the active units. And if he lived/signed up in London..would this not be part of his division as everywhere else I read localities mentioned in the names?

[veeblevort]

Hi Mrsspen,

I'm not a military person, but I've been Googling your enquiry, and offer the following:

Wikipedia here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Order_of_battle_for_the_Battle_of_the_Somme

provides information which I may be misinterpreting, so judge for yourself.

It appears from this that 1 Battalion Rifle Brigade were a regular army unit, i.e. not one of Kitchener's callup.

They formed part of the fourth division of the army which fought at the battles of Albert, 1-13 Jul 1916, and at the Battle of Le Transloy, 1-18 Oct 1918, which appeared to involve capturing Eaucourt L'Abbaye and le Sars, and attacking the Butte de Warlencourt. According to CWGC William died on the 18th, sadly the final day of the battle.

Entering le sars into google maps and zooming a little shows these three places to be all within a mile of each other. Must be worth a trip one day. I know a few people who have made this kind of pilgrimage, and they all report it as profoundly moving.

I see others have been busy while I was looking this up! You have a concern about the unit being active. Wikipedia shows the fourth division in battle, and not in reserve. No doubt a War Diary could confirm this.

Good luck with your research.

[corisande]

If he was in 1st Battalion Rifle Brigade (I have not checked your source), then you can get the War Diary online for £3.50
http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/documentsonline/details-result.asp?Edoc_Id=8199319&queryType=1&resultcount=8

It will give you original pencil war diary, at times they are difficult to decipher, but usually give a good day by day account of what the battalion were doing, and what in particular they were were doing when he died.

[mrsspen]

I cannot thank you enough for such help. This website is fantastic. On the odd times I've posted I've been given such fab help.

I ordered the war diaries and there is a large entry for the 18th oct namely the officer casualties listed. But Im finding it really really hard to deciper the scrawl! I may have to try and sit down and transcribe it like a will. Its not easy when its all jargon to me.

The place looks like LES BOGU7S ??
where?