Lulworth Cove, Mervyn O'GORMAN photos?

[Regorian]

Considering the interest generated not only here but in Europe and U.S. it's suspicious that no one, from the family or anyone else, has any explanations. Barring accidents, 'Christina' could have lived into the 1980's.

Google images for Christina Gorman or O'Gorman bring up lots of pics. including contemporary as in now. 

[kilkennylass]

The garden pictures look like they would have been taken in late May / early June - lilac in full flower.     

Thanks LizzeL ! i thought it could be a buddleia, with maybe a clematis thats finished flowering.

Could the house be owned by a friend of Mervyn's, be situated close to Lulworth / Durdle Door and the girls are the daughters (or related in some way) to the owner of the house rather than related to Mervyn.   

very possible. in fact, looking more likely ! My next task was going to be looking at the 1911 census for the area, basically reading it and seeing if anything jumped out. 

The nearest large house I can think of would be Lulworth Castle. Although one website did suggest it was Rempstone Hall near Corfe. But that sounds a bit far to pop down to the beach at Durdle.   

I've looked at both these places, concentrating on any images of the gardens/grounds, and can't really pinpoint anything.  Found some aeriel images of Rempstone Hall from the 1950's, but nothing in them stands out as being our 'garden'.  But still looking

Durdle Door is about 15 miles by road from Rempstone Hall (according to the aa route planner thingy), don't know if any more direct routes existed in 1913.  As Rusoftheeast says, Mervyn would  certainly have had a car (very keen motorist, and had the money), and whever the 'garden' was if thats where they were staying, perhaps Durdle Door was a day trip from there, hence the picnic ?

I am fairly convinced that the image 1 and 11 are of the same girl that we are looking for.Different lighting and was taken from a lower angle and the image 11 being taken possibly years later.

I tried in photoshop to overlay the two portraits, to see if eye width, nose shape, lips etc matched up, and they don't.....but will try again.  If its shown its not the same girl.....can open, worms everywhere !

Well lets see what the cousin of Winifred and RPS say.It would be lovely to see the actual photos but I live in the far east of Russia so England is literally the opposite side of the world to me.I would have to leave the visit to you

I would love to see the original glass plates, if only to confirm which is the correct way round for them all (well, 6 & 10 are certainly correct the way I have them, you can't have durdle door any other way). Still waiting for a reply to two collection visit requests.

I do feel an urge to visit Dorset...Corfe Castle is only 2 1/2 hours away !

[kilkennylass]

A little bit of info re Mervyn and his car and where he was in 1913.

If he did drive to Dorset in 1913, he did so with an expired license ! Found this wonderful piece in the Middlesex Chronicle for Saturday Jan 31 1914....

"Mervyn O'Gorman, of 21, Embankment Gardens, Chelsea, was summoned for driving a motor car at Staines-road, Sunbury, on December 29th, at a speed exceeding 20miles per hour, and also without a licence. P.S Jones deposed that the speed of the car was 34miles 1083 yards per hour.  Defendant's licence had expired in February, 1913, and it was renewed the day after he was stopped, a space of ten months intervening. A number of previous convictions were proved. Mr Parkes, who appeared for the defendant, said O'Gorman had no occasion to look at his licence and was not aware it had expired. Fined £5 for excessive speed and £1 for driving without a license."

So he most certainly had a car in 1913, and liked to drive at nearly 35miles an hour !

But it does raise an interesting possibility.  London to Dorset with a speed limit of 20miles an hour (poss higher on some roads, but surely nothing above 40 ?) is a very long journey, and not one probably made in a day.  You would probably split your journey half way for a night or two.  Could the garden images be at where they possibly stayed for a few days mid journey to Dorset ? They could have taken the trian of course, but still intriging.

Another newspaper article from Friday August 29th 1913, says

"Army Flying Corps
Fine Demonstration Given at Farnborough
Theer was a fine demonstration of the progress made in aviation by the Royal Flying Corps yesterday evening, when General Henderson, the newly appointed Inspector-General of Military Aviation visited Farnborough. The general was conducted through the sheds by Mr Mervyn O'Gorman.
General Henderson afterwards made an ascent in the Beta Airship.  He also saw Mr Ronald Kent take up his equerry, Major Broncker, in the B.E No 4990, the fastest biplane the Army at present possesses. Ascending to a height of over 2,000ft the biplane made a tour of Farnborough Common, and then descended safely.  General Henderson's pilot in the Beta was Captain Waterlow, of the Royal Flying Corps.
The Inspector-General subsequently saw half a dozen biplanes ascend together to a height of 2,000ft, and witnessed some clever feats of volplaning and banking. The weather was beautifully fine, and the conditions were perfect for flying"

So he was in Farnborough, Hampshire on Thursday August 28th 1913, West London on Sunday December 29th 1913, and yet another newspaper report has him in Aldershot for an inquest on October 15th 1913.

[Rusoftheeast]

  ""1904 O'GORMAN, Mervyn, 82, Victoria Street, London, S.W. Cars: Oldsmobile, 5-h.p. electric victoria (Still system). Total distance travelled since becoming a motorist. About 15,000 miles. Hobbies: Touring with camera, sketching, shooting. Principal aim in furthering automobilism: To promote the use by municipalities and others of motor-cars instead of trams; to open up poor districts and the colonies by good roads and cars, instead of delaying development until the remote time when the heavy Standing charges of a railway could he met. Club: Burlington Fine Arts. [1] ""

It would appear that Mervyn indeed loved touring with camera and promoted cars instead of trams.

Mervyn being "a charming and humorous man with enormous physical and mental energy" and quite easy going that he would drive with an expired license,I can easily imagine him driving to Dorset from London even taking more than a day or two.I doubt that he would have made a trip to Dorset by train.

And yes it is likely the Christina was a daughter of his friend living in Dorset but that raises some questions about the portrait of younger Christina and the image 11 and the fact he had taken photos of her on many different occasions,possibly more are out there unpublished or destroyed.Maybe she was TOURING with him from London?

He had a firm named ""O'Gorman and Cozens-Hardy in London"" with E. H. Cozens-Hardy from  Automobile Club of Great Britain and Ireland,later from 1907 known as Royal Automobile Club.

He must have had a lot of friends from the club who also liked cars.He could have been touring with his car loving friend(s) with their daughters and wife,whom Mervyn had also known for years.

[brionne]

Having had a look at this very interesting post,my answer is to obtain hard facts.
Pretty sure to me that Christina may well be Mervyn Gormans natural daughter,which is why no one has yet come forward to verify her.
FindMyPast has a marriage record in the Cornish Telegraph dated Thursday July 29th 1937.
Lavish wedding at St Buryan Parish Church West Cornwall,where Col Mervyn O Gorman gave wedding presents ,,,,,Gold fox brooch,and china horse.Detailed newspaper account,with aviation and auto friends were guests,the bridal pairs car being shipped to Scandinavia where they extensively toured on honeymoon.On no account am I suggesting that there is any connection to the missing Christina but this just helps to fill in the later background.

[kilkennylass]

This is interesting .... from the Bath Chronicle 13 October 1934

"Street Obstruction - Mervyn O'Gorman, Embankment Gardens, Chelsea, was summoned for obstructing Stall Street with a motor car on Sept 20th.

P.C James said the car was left from 11.50am to 12.35pm.  When the defendant returned he said "My wife went to have her hair dressed, and I went into Woolworth's to wait for her" (laughter). Traffic was very heavy, and at 12.20pm the whole street was blocked"

It goes on to say he pleaded quilty and was fined £1......but his wife had died in 1931 !  Was he just being flippant, joking wanting to raise a laugh, or had he atually re-married, or was he referring to his companion Charlotte Copland (although I can't place her with him any earlier than 1948) ?

In 1933 he self-published a book of poetry, and it is dedicated to Nicolette Hornby.  I thought it could be a line of enquiry....but it wasn't.  She was the wife of one of his neighbours.  I happen to have a first edition of the book, and on the inside cover it says, in pen, "To Joan with many rememberances from the author 30.3.33".  Joan is the name of one of Florences great-neices who match the approx age for being Christina

With regards to Florences great nieces ... one of her elder brothers was
Frederick Charles Rasch (1843-1887) who married in 1871 & had one daughter
Mildred Alice Sothern Rasch (1879-1965)
who married in 1879 and had 1 son and 3 daughters ...
the daughters are Winsome Joyce (1897-2000), Joan Mildred (1900-1948) and Jocelyn Maureen (1903-2000)

Therefore in 1913 the sisters were 16, 13 and 10 respectively.  In the 1911 census the sisters are visiting their paternal grandparents in Bath, and their mother Mildred and her 2nd husband were living in Devon.  All 3 sisters married and had children.

No idea if its a coincidence, or a lead.

[brionne]

Unable to come up with anything on your interesting post Kilkenny Lass,but have had a look for a second marriage for Mervyn.    Florence had died in Chelsea 1931.[they were orginally married in San Remo USA 1897]

Possible marriage.
This one comes up 1938 Maidstone,,,,, Mervyn J, O Gorman to a certain Gladys E Bull. Traced her via 1911,she appears to be the daughter of an invoice clerk at a Motor Tyre Company.
Parents, Thomas C,and Evaline M.Bull,living 33 Finborough Rd Fulham.Gladys born Kensington 1907.

This does not help much,but am asking myself if the photos are actually what they are supposed to be,some could be much later say 1930s.

[kilkennylass]

The 1938 O'Gorman/Bull marriage is a Mervyn John aged 25.....i thought the same as you Brionne, possible 2nd marriage so looked into it.

I've gone with Mervyn & Florences marriage being San Remo, Italy not USA.  The transcription on Findmypast says USA, but the actual page makes no mention of USA so not sure where FindMyPast got that from.  San Remo Italy is just along the coast from where his parents were living at the time, so I've plumped for Italy but hung a big question mark on it.

"where the images really taken in 1913" and "where the images really taken by O'Gorman" are two big things that I question every day.  Part of me thinks, someone, somewhere would have found out by now if either of those huge 'facts' weren't correct.  But then maybe the images, and him, haven't really been under any scrutiny before now.   A lot of times the images aren't even the correct way round ! As you say Brionne, hard facts are needed, but they are hard to come by and even when you think you have one, they might contradict another ! Its what makes the story so fascinating...

[brionne]

Thanks KLass,you obviously have got into this in great depth.
Believe though that Mervyns marriage to Florence could still be San Remo New York.
The image gives no countries, being written in longhand,c1893,they are all British Consular marriages,
includes at least one in S.America,so not confined to Europe.
Does anyone have sight of the certificate to confirm this either way.
As regards the Mervyn John birth,still could be a connection.Born in close area,etc,just surmising.