Author Topic: The Diary of Nathaniel Bryceson (Part 4)  (Read 46229 times)

Offline Steven Bryceson

  • RootsChat Extra
  • **
  • Posts: 90
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: The Diary of Nathaniel Bryceson (Part 4)
« Reply #216 on: Friday 30 July 10 16:04 BST (UK) »
Dear all,

I am very excited about grave info- a bit of NB in all of us isn't there!

The grave I found in Abney Park was of another relative, a Hurran, on the side of a great grandmother who married NB's grandson Henry.

I have been to St Anne's Soho. The churchyard has been totally re-ordered and there is no evidence of Mary Ward or thousands of other people buried there - though there is a tomb for William Hazlitt! Here is good info on the cemetery - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/St_Anne's_Church,_Soho

I guess I will need help at Islington Cemetery from someone who can help me find the grave of NB.

Yes, I would love to hear news of any Stangroom or other NB descendants.

My walk went very well - NB would have loved it (although it was a bit light-weight for him at only 16 miles a day). Those on Facebook can see my lovely photos from the walk.

I will not spill the beans on August 8th but I am glad to have learnt how WCC are dealing with the entry: very clev**r!

I'll be away from my office for a couple of weeks so please excuse my pending silence!


Peace to all,

Steven.

Offline deb usa

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 8,394
    • View Profile
Re: The Diary of Nathaniel Bryceson (Part 4)
« Reply #217 on: Friday 30 July 10 16:24 BST (UK) »
Dear all,

I will not spill the beans on August 8th but I am glad to have learnt how WCC are dealing with the entry: very clev**r!



Oh My ...don't tell me they're going to post the entry in Shorthand  ;D
Travellers = Penfold, Orchard, James
Devon = Middleton,  Waterfield, Adams, Clark/e, Gould
Cornwall = Palmer, Carnarton, Slack/Smith. Morris/h
Wales, New Quay = James, Evans


All UK census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline HeatherLynne

  • RootsChat Aristocrat
  • ******
  • Posts: 1,268
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: The Diary of Nathaniel Bryceson (Part 4)
« Reply #218 on: Friday 30 July 10 16:28 BST (UK) »
That's OK if it's Pitman shorthand  ;)  now I know why I spent two years learning it  ;D
Rassell - South Hayling/Portsea/Chelsea,  Hellyer - Totnes/Islington,  Roots - Hackney,  Edden - St Pancras

Offline deb usa

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 8,394
    • View Profile
Re: The Diary of Nathaniel Bryceson (Part 4)
« Reply #219 on: Friday 30 July 10 16:44 BST (UK) »
Hi Heather

Yey!!  ;D

That's OK if it's Pitman shorthand ;) now I know why I spent two years learning it ;D

...we're onto you, Nathaniel  ;D

deb
Travellers = Penfold, Orchard, James
Devon = Middleton,  Waterfield, Adams, Clark/e, Gould
Cornwall = Palmer, Carnarton, Slack/Smith. Morris/h
Wales, New Quay = James, Evans


All UK census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk


Offline Mongibello

  • RootsChat Extra
  • **
  • Posts: 52
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: The Diary of Nathaniel Bryceson (Part 4)
« Reply #220 on: Friday 30 July 10 16:50 BST (UK) »
There is a Nathaniel White in Great Quebec Street, Marylebone in the '41 census, a Chairmaker aged 50, not born in Middlesex.
There is a N W married in Marylebone in 1844 but he is described as "Gent" in the occupation column.   So rather unlikely.
There is a N W who died in December Quarter of 1862 (i.e. c71yrs if it is the same one).   I will try to check the records when I am at Westminster next Tuesday.   He may be buried in the Marylebone cemetery which is just along the North Circular Road from the Islington one.

Offline deb usa

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 8,394
    • View Profile
Re: The Diary of Nathaniel Bryceson (Part 4)
« Reply #221 on: Friday 30 July 10 17:04 BST (UK) »
Hi Mongibello

Yep ...we  think that Nat, the chairmaker may be NB's dad. Ruskie had followed him through to 1861.

It's so great of you to do all of this for Steven and us ...I am so envious of you being there ...maybe one day we should all meet up for a "Nathaniel Bryceson Party" ...we could plan to walk his routes, see 'his' places ....  ooooo wouldn't that be wonderful!


deb ...day dreaming  ;D
Travellers = Penfold, Orchard, James
Devon = Middleton,  Waterfield, Adams, Clark/e, Gould
Cornwall = Palmer, Carnarton, Slack/Smith. Morris/h
Wales, New Quay = James, Evans


All UK census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline nestagj

  • RootsChat Veteran
  • *****
  • Posts: 909
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: The Diary of Nathaniel Bryceson (Part 4)
« Reply #222 on: Friday 30 July 10 17:48 BST (UK) »
Here we are then more info on the Stangroom family – I will do the same for the other Bryceson children when I am in the mood – it makes a change from looking for Jones’ and other good (common) welsh names !   If anyone has already done it please let me know I can’t remember seeing much apart from Steve’s line.  I do enjoy moving towards the present in a family line and have been working on a section of our family which we have lost contact with.  If anyone want the unedited version - which is also a bit tidier please pm me your email address and I will send you the word doc.  Let me just hint that I think (as long as my assumptions are correct) Steve has definitely got some distant Bryceson relatives out there.

Please remember this is all supposition from using the online indexes available certificates would be required to confirm the information

Edith Sarah Stangroom married Stanley Ernest Atwell on the 2nd January 1916 at Christ Church, Jamaica Street (another Church that’s now gone) http://www.geograph.org.uk/photo/1508785 .  Their record is on the London Marriages; the marriage was witnessed by Walter James Stangroom and Florence Ethel Stangroom; his father was William Atwell, Engineer and her’s (as we know) Walter James Stangroom, Carman.  His occupation is listed as Fitter and she’s a Machinist.  Both residences are listed as 102 Dempsey Street.
I can only find one child Stanley Ernest born in the June quarter of 1917 in Hackney; he married Audrey Maude Greengrass (1924) in the June quarter of 1947in Essex and they had one child in the June quarter of 1948 xxxxx again in Hackney. 
There are two possible deaths for Stanley (1) one in 1979 at Waltham Forest and one in 1971 in Hendon but considering that Edith died in 1970 in Waltham Forest I would assume the first is correct.  Audrey died at Reading in July 2004 and Stanley (2) in August 2005 in Harlow in Essex. 

1.   Chunk of info about living people

NB – Audrey Maude Greengrass in mistrascribed as Greengrase and their child has been mistranscribed as xxxxx on A*** but correctly on FindMyPast.

Walter Bryceson Stangroom married Edith H Danson in Croydon in the December quarter of 1914 they had two children Gladys Edith born in the December quarter of 1915 and Walter J born in the March quarter of 1921 both in West Ham.  The gap between the children would suggest some kind of Military service and I have found a possible medal card for him but nothing else – but of course the records aren’t all there. 

Walter B died in Darwen Lancs in 1962 aged 78 and Edith died in Lancs in 1966 aged 78.

Gladys married a Ramsay G G Langlands in Surrey in the June quarter of 1939; I’ve found his birth in the June quarter of 1912 in Northumberland.   I can’t trace any children here despite such unusual names.  She died in November 1991 in Surrey and he died in December 1986 again in Surrey.

Walter J (I assume James) married a Sylvia P Moore in the March quarter of 1943 in Surrey . Sylvia died in Leeds in 1981 and Walter in 1982 in Huddersfield.

1.   Chunk of info about living people

Florence Ethel Stangroom has been harder to trace and the closest I can find is a Florence Ethel Stancombe who marries a Charles Crisp in the December quarter of 1921 in Surrey.  There is only one Crisp / Stancombe birth and that’s in Devon in 1924 but there are no Crisp / Stangroom births.  I’m not sure its so easy to make assumptions.  Thing is there are too many Florence Crisp deaths but no Florence Stangroom deaths.

Please any corrections anyone can make throw them into the pot.
N

Offline Ruskie

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 26,276
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: The Diary of Nathaniel Bryceson (Part 4)
« Reply #223 on: Saturday 31 July 10 04:49 BST (UK) »
There is a Nathaniel White in Great Quebec Street, Marylebone in the '41 census, a Chairmaker aged 50, not born in Middlesex.
There is a N W married in Marylebone in 1844 but he is described as "Gent" in the occupation column.   So rather unlikely.
There is a N W who died in December Quarter of 1862 (i.e. c71yrs if it is the same one).   I will try to check the records when I am at Westminster next Tuesday.   He may be buried in the Marylebone cemetery which is just along the North Circular Road from the Islington one.

I also found this death. Is it the same one?:
Nathaniel White
died 4th Oct 1862
age 77 of 'old age'
St Marylebone, Westminster.

Deb is right, I traced the charimaker Nathaniel White through the censuses and he seems to be living in a good area with a steady job, so I have my doubts that this is our Nathaniel White, pauper, father of Nathaniel.

Unless we have some kind of clue, we are really only guessing. It could even be that Nathaniel's father was passing through London - and could have come from, and returned to ... anywhere.  :-\

Steven, in one of your first posts you mentioned that there was a rumour in the family of illegitimacy and mention of the surname White. Are you able to speak to any older relatives who may know a little more
about this rumour? Anything at all that may help us track Nathaniel down.  :-\

[Gee you've been busy nestagj! Great stuff. We might want to check with Mongibello before tracing any other descendants as he has already done some work on this I believe.  ;)]

ADDED:
Nathaniel's marriage to Sarah Clark
June 18 1854
Nathaniel Bryceson, full age, commercial clerk, residence: Edwards Cottages, father: Nathaniel Bryceson,
cabinet maker


- Cabinet maker is not a million miles from Chair maker
- I wonder if Nathaniel knew he was born White but said he was Bryceson to appear more respectable
- I would say that he did know, and that is how he knew his father's occupation (maybe Mary told him the truth onher death bed?  ;)

Offline Ruskie

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 26,276
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: The Diary of Nathaniel Bryceson (Part 4)
« Reply #224 on: Saturday 31 July 10 05:02 BST (UK) »
Steven, I suspected we wouldn't have any luck finding graves at St Anne Soho. Shame.  :(

You are just making it worse with all this teasing about the famous August diary entry!

Thinking about Nathaniel White chairmaker again. I can't see Mary having a relationship with a pauper so this may be the right Nathaniel White, and perhaps he was just down on his luck or ill so was in the workhouse. I think he's the only likely one in the area at the time.