Author Topic: James & agnes Disher  (Read 36981 times)

Offline MonicaL

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Re: James & agnes Disher
« Reply #45 on: Tuesday 13 July 10 10:43 BST (UK) »
Hi Christine  :)

Regarding Agnes' mother's details on the MC you have attached, looks like:

Bethia McKenzie, formerly Stewart, previously Ross, maiden surname McDonald

Three marriages for her it would seem from these details I think.

For Andrew's father, Thomas, the word in brackets reads 'deceased'.

Monica
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Offline MonicaL

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Re: James & agnes Disher
« Reply #46 on: Tuesday 13 July 10 12:54 BST (UK) »
I am beginning to have a mad, mad thought  ::) ;D

Just the names from that last marriage entry you have found Chris. Re-read all this thread again from scratch.

What are the chances of the two Disher brothers both marrying an Agnes Ross? What if Agnes Ross ran away with James to Australia (may explain why there is no marriage to be found after all the many searches). I am going to try and list down my niggle/alarm bells - try to do it in order although it may not come out at way!:

- We now have an Agnes Ross, aged 21 marrying Andrew Disher in 1878 in Glasgow. She shows as a hotel barmaid......which fits well with reply No.2: Story goes that it was because he married Agnes Ross who was a Innkeepers daughter.

- I cannot see a death for Agnes prior to Andrew's second marriage that Ambly found from an Ancestry tree: Andrew DISHER married Helen GEDDES  - 2 Feb 1888, Glasgow Would be interesting to see what Andrew's marital status is on this his marriage entry (widower/bachelor).

- We had a summary from Ambly on post No. 31:

and Elizabeth's mother, not much luck with her either:
Agnes McDonald ROSS
Born abt 1861 Scotland(from Death registration 1924 age 63)
Father : ROSS (ditto)
Mother Jean McDONALD (ditto)
Supposed to be an Innkeepers daughter
Supposed to be in Gateshead visting her husband James, when Elizabeth was born 8 Mar 1886 - Agnes & John had a son born in Australia in that year - technically possible to have had another child by the end of 1886 -  what was James's exact dob in 1886?
Supposed to have come to Australia, with her husband when dau Elizabeth was 18mnths old.

The names we have from the 1878 marriage for Agnes' mother: McKenzie, Ross, McDonald, Stewart. Some bells ringing with Elizabeth's name perhaps: Elizabeth Sutherland McKenzie Disher. We also know from Agnes' death details in Australia that her mother's maiden name was McDonald. And then that possible census entry found in post No. 34:

John McDonald 56, house painter b. Edinburgh, Mid Lothian
Berthia McDonald 50 b. Spakout (?spl), Dumbarton
Berthia McDonald 27, b. Helsintz, Dumbartonshire
Catherine McDonald 16, b. Glasgow
Agnes Ross 3 granddaughter b. Glasgow
Archibald Love 22 son in law, confectioner b. Glasgow
Euphemia Love 24 b. Helensburg, Dumbarton
John Love 11 Months, grandson b. Glasgow

Address: 8 Pembroke Street, Anderston, Glasgow

I am wondering whether her mother was Bethia not Jane?


So many clues, am I going madly off track here?  ;D

Monica

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Offline MonicaL

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Re: James & agnes Disher
« Reply #47 on: Tuesday 13 July 10 13:07 BST (UK) »
I wonder if this is Agnes following her marriage in 1881:

Agnes Disher, 22, b. Glasgow, House Maid; Dom. Serv. working at the Temperance Hotel, 12 Hutcheson St. Blythswood, Glasgow

Monica
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Offline MonicaL

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Re: James & agnes Disher
« Reply #48 on: Tuesday 13 July 10 15:42 BST (UK) »
A little bit more...and blowing part of my new thoughts!

The Andrew Disher that we had earlier who married a Helen Geddes is not connected to this line I think. His parents on his MC show as James, a cooper by trade, and an Elizabeth Morrison, both deceased. He shows as 29, a bachelor, and a knitting machine labourer.

The big problem I am having though is trying to find anything on anyone at present that we have seen on marriage certs.

Can't see this Andrew who married in 1888 in the earlier censuses at all (from 1881 back) and as for Agnes Ross, who married in 1878, struggling to see anything on her reported mother and her many marriages with all the surnames we have  :-\

Monica
Census information Crown Copyright, www.nationalarchives.gov.uk


Offline Christine Lockett

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Re: James & agnes Disher
« Reply #49 on: Wednesday 14 July 10 10:06 BST (UK) »
Hi Monica

Glad you could read it I could pick out the surnames funny thing is my maiden name is Stewart.

You were wondering if Bertha was Agnes mother not Jane, if you look through some of the previous information you sent Agnes's fathers name is Thomas not William and you also mentioned you couldn't find them again after 1861. 

Maybe something happened to them Thomas and William could of been brothers or could be same person Thomas William Ross or vice Vera.

James was born 1885 (not 86) (will attach birth certificate)
Elizabeth b. 1886
Ellen Kelvin b. 1887 (Kelvin is listed as the District on James birth registration.

Been in touch with a relation of Ellen's and pointed out that on her death certificate that her middle name is  Mangin not Kelvin (we knew of her as Auntie May) different sort of name have you heard of it before.


Have looked for children born to Andrew & Agnes between 1887-1885 seven years is a long time for such a Young couple to be married and not have other children especially in those days????(IE. twins)  what a tangled web...

Chris

Offline MonicaL

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Re: James & agnes Disher
« Reply #50 on: Wednesday 14 July 10 10:19 BST (UK) »
Hi Chris

Attached is an 1858 birth cert not James' 1885 one...

Monica
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Offline Christine Lockett

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Re: James & agnes Disher
« Reply #51 on: Wednesday 14 July 10 10:37 BST (UK) »
Hi Monica,

Sorry hope this better

Chris

Offline MonicaL

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Re: James & agnes Disher
« Reply #52 on: Wednesday 14 July 10 10:56 BST (UK) »
Thanks Chris  :) An Engineer's Crane Keeper for occupation for father Andrew. Wish we could get a better steer on him  :-\
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Offline MonicaL

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Re: James & agnes Disher
« Reply #53 on: Wednesday 14 July 10 11:00 BST (UK) »
Re your question on the surname Mangin, there are some entries coming up for it on IGI in Scotland, spelt either Mangan/Mangin/Mengin etc.

Monica
Census information Crown Copyright, www.nationalarchives.gov.uk