Can anyone find this John Smith in 51, 61 or 71?

[millymcb]

Hi all,

I have found a John Smith occupation Sizer in 1841. Can anyone see him in a later census 51, 61, 71 (or find a marriage for him,  or birth for his daughter Alice?)

He died in Feb 1873 - occupation Sizer age 70 (78 Henry St, informant was one of his grand-daughters. Buried at Philips Park with daughter's family - no mention of a wife/widow)

His daughter's marriage cert (to John Tiplady)  in October 1847 at Manchester Cathedral gives his occupation as sizer.  Witnesses were John Tiplady's parents so no help there)

I don't have a marriage for him
I don't have a census 1841 for his daughter Alice either. She would be about 9 or 10 and married as a minor in 1847.

I can't find his daughter Alice's birth (abt 1830/1) in Chorley or Preston
Her children were Margaret, Mary Ann, Florence Nightingale, Elizabeth Ann and Annie


There are so many John Smiths around and I don't have anything to go on other than his occupation so unless it actually says sizer I am a bit stuck. Unfortunately this one (the only sizer I have managed to find) has him on his own and not with family so I don't know if he is my man.  I am hoping to find him again later perhaps with some other family members or some address I may recognize.

In 1847 his daughter gave her address as 1  Dawson Street.

Fingers crossed

Thanks

Milly

PS I have accounted for daughter Alice and her children in 1871 (in and around Henry St) and he is not with them

[CaroleW]

I have found a John Smith occupation Sizer in 1841

Where in Lancs?  Can we have the 1841 reference please?

Does it show him as born in or not born in Lancashire?

Does the entry confirm a birthyear of around 1803 (allowing for the 5yr rounding on the 1841)

Re: Alice

The only possible 1841 I can find was b 1829 living in Preston with John & Amelia Grime

HO107 Piece 499 Book 3 Folio 36 Page 23

[millymcb]

sorry - forgot to put that vital bit ofinfo in

Name:  John Smith
Age: 35 about 1806

Civil Parish..Manchester
Hundred.. Salford

Address: Mount Street   (Market Street District)

John Smith 35 SIZER BORN IN COUNTY
Frances Holspen? 45 FEMALE FUSTIAN CUTTER
Richd Brigham 30 CALICO PRINTER
3 X Gregory family
5 x Siddall family
2 x Blay family
William Mash 80
 
HO107; 573 ;1-3;  1 

If this is him he appears to be either separated from wife, a widower or working away from home.   Where is daughter Alice - either at home with mother - or in the care of others. she would only be about aged 10

However, on the plus side, Market St area is nearer the manchester area Alice and her family ended up in. She married at Manchester Cathedral and gave address as Dawson St, then   lived in Potts St in 1851 and then Henry St with family until old age. (and that is where John Smith died in 1873)



Today I have been very kindly helped by PM to find the following too...none of them have Alice there though.



1841 - a sizer but still no Alice with him Smith John 45  Cotton    Chatburn    Not born in county   SIZER
Smith Ann age 53  Chatburn,  Not born in county   
Smith James age 23  Cotton Weaver   Not born in county 
Smith Hannah age 20 Cotton Weaver Not born in county 
Smith Mary age 18  Cotton Weaver 
Smith Ann age 17  Cotton Weaver   
Smith Jonathan age 15  Cotton Weaver 
Smith Ruth age 12    Chatburn

ADDRESS: Chatburn, Whalley, Clitheroe
H107, 507, 1/7, 8



Following on with John and Ann I found..
1851
poss 1851   
ADDRES: Chatburn, Clitheroe, Lancs
 
SMITH, John   age    55   b1796    Sizer Factory  born Hilltop, Yorkshire
SMITH, Ann   age   62   b 1789                          born Skipton Yorkshire

RG107:2256:1105:8
 


1851 census
I don't think this is him because he is too young and Deborah is definitely not a name ever used in the family, and also he ended up where the rest of his family were in Ancoats, Ardwick not in Cheshire
Mottram Road Godley Cheshire Ashton Under-Lyne

Smith John age 33 Head Cotton Yarn Sizer Ashton Lancashire   
Smith Deborah age 30 Wife Cotton Yarn Twister Cattisley Cheshire   
Whitworth Nancyage  63 Mother In Law House Keeper Cattisley Cheshire   
Whitworth John age 24 Brother In Law Cotton Weaver Hyde Cheshire   
Whitworth Maria age 11 Niece Scholar Godley Cheshire   
Whitworth Sarah ag e10 Niece Scholar Godley Cheshire

H107, 2235,39,20

And in 1861 there is..
1861
ADDRESS Waterloo, Clitheroe
Hanson Richard 48 Head Cotton Tackler born Downham, Lancashire   
Smith John 60 Step Brother Cotton Sizer born Downham   
Gudgeon Ellen 62 Sister - Housekeeper born Downham

RG9, 3087, 26,46






AND LOOKING AT WHERE ALICE MAY BE IN 1841
There is this one
 
All born in county (apart from Thomas Singleton)

ADDRESS Frenchwood Square, Preston
HOLME, John            age 45   1796       CARDER
HOLME, Margaret    age 45   1796      
TEMPEST, Mary    age    50   1791       ?
SMITH, Alice    age    10   1831      
SINGLETON, William   age    50   1791         OVERLOOKER
SINGLETON, Lucy   age    50   1791       ?
SINGLETON, James   age    15   1826       SPINNER
SINGLETON, Thomas    20   1821      
SINGLETON, James   age    5   1836      
SINGLETON, Lucy   age  10   1831      

HO107, 498, 7-17, 28   

There are probably other lone Alice's around too.


Your one with John and Amelia Grime looks very good too.

ADDRESS Croft St, Preston all born in county
John Grime 30   mechanic
Amelia Grime 35
Mary Grime  25 cotton reeler
Alice Smith  age 12 Nurse

HO107,499, 3-36, 23


Grime is not a name I recognize, and neither are any of the ones in the other 1841 census. 

I have to admit I am getting rather confused.  i was hoping to find John and Alice together and it doesn't look like I am going to, which is making it rather difficult


Milly 

[DrewDalton]

Just adding. I know this is an old post but registering my interest as its associated with my family tree.