Robert Smith born 1853 Edinburgh

[hume]

Hi Carolyn,

This is the 1861 census entry that I found. Edward is a coach builder in this one which I'm not sure relates to either an engraver or a baker but they did tend to change their trades depending on where they lived etc.

Address: 17 Gibb's Entry, Edinburgh, Midlothian
Edward Swan, m, head, 44, coach builder, b. St Cuthberts', Edinburgh
Janet Swan, f, wife, 30, -, b. St Cuthberts', Edinburgh
Robert Swan, m, son, 6, scholar, b. St Cuthberts', Edinburgh
Jessie Swan, f, dau., 3, -, b. St Cuthberts', Edinburgh

hume

[islay 1]

Hi,Hume,thank you very much for sending me  the census information. I didn't realise that people changed their jobs like you said,but should have thought of it.I wonder if I could take up just a little more of your time?

 Could you explain to me about the births of children between Edward Swann and Janet McLaren that yesterday you said you'd found?Somehow you've discovered that my great grandfather's (Robert Smith b.1853 Edinburgh,married Mary Byron,Greenock)parents were Edward Smith and Janet Smith,nee McLaren,so presumably this confirms that they were married?(Where can I find this information that you did?)Could Edward Smith have died and is this Janet in the census of 1861 the same lady who has now married Edward Swan,do you think?I'm still trying to find a link here  - feel we're getting so close!How do the dates for these births look as a possibility?
Thank you very much for your help,Carolyn

[hume]

Hi Carolyn,

This is quite a confusing one. I will try to lay it out best as possible though.

Edward Swan was born 9th August 1815 in Edinburgh, son of Edward Swan and Elizabeth Maxwell. This is a submitted entry on the IGI, so it would need to be confirmed by the OPRs at SP. Edward appears with parents in the 1841 census at South Leith:

Address: Kirkgate, South Leith, Midlothian
Edward Swan, m, 50, tailor (journeyman), b. outside county
Elizabeth Swan, f, 50, milliner, b. outside county
Edward Swan, m, 20, coach builder (journeyman), b. in county

According to birth certificate of the unnamed daughter Swan born 1863, Edward Swan and Janet McLaren married 1845 in Edinburgh (no exact date given).

In 1851, I cannot see the family. However, there is an Edward Smith, joiner, aged 33 lodging in Edinburgh with an Alexander Smith, aged 6. Maybe someone else can take a look? Edward's parents are staying at Tolbooth Wynd, South Leith in 1851. Two grandchildren; Edward, a scholar, aged 7 and Jane, aged 2.

In 1861, we have the family above. Edward's parents are still living in 1861, at North Gray's Close, Edinburgh. The two grandchildren are staying with them; Edward, 17, who now works as a dic & staurp?? cutter and Jane, 13.

I believe Janet Swan m.s. McLaren died October 8th 1868 in the St Cuthberts' Poorhouse. She is described as the wife of Edward Swan, pauper and she was 38. No parents' names and the death was registered by a poorhouse official, I think.

Edward Swan died December 12th 1868 in the Poorhouse; although confusingly, he is listed as the widower of Elizabeth Begbie. He was 54 and his parents are as above, both deceased. Death was registered by his son, Edward Swan.

However, where does the name change come from? I don't easily see Robert in 1871 to question where he went after the death of his parents.

hume

[islay 1]

Dear Hume,I have been looking forward to your reply all day,as I am very eager to find out how this mystery resolves itself,and I thank you very much for all the trouble and work you have obviously gone to.

May I ask you to confirm what I think you said another day,that Robert Smith,b1853 in Edinburgh,who went on to become a ship's rigger and to marry Mary Byron,stated that his parents were Edward Smith and Janet Mclaren on his marriage certificate,and were they themselves married?i.e.janet Smith nee McLaren?

Is it possible if that was the case that Edward Smith died quite soon after Robert's birth and Janet remarried again,this time to Edward Swan?Could he have brought up Robert ?
Lastly,(sorry!)when you say that Edward's parents are staying at Tolbooth Wynd,with the grandchildren,do you mean Edward Smith or Edward Swan's parents?

Are all family histories as puzzling as this one is to me?Thank you again for all your help,Carolyn

[hume]

Hi Carolyn,

I believe Edward Smith and Edward Swan are one and the same, and Swan is the "true" family name. For whatever reasons, it seems Robert himself chose Smith as his surname and used it when he married and afterwards. He also seems to think (or make up) his father was a baker ... when in fact it seems he was a coach builder or similar.

Edward Swan/Smith and Janet McLaren were married as per their daughter's birth record; however, I cannot see any record of this. This isn't too unusual as some marriages were never registered or have been lost. It's also another possibility the marriage was carried out in another denomination from the Church of Scotland.

The parents I mention are Swans, parents of Edward who married Janet.

hume

[islay 1]

Hi,Hume,thank you  for the very detailed information that you sent in answer to my(seemingly endless) queries.It seems that I have quite a few mysteries in my family life! However,you have done so much work to help me unravel them,and I am most appreciative.

I suspect that this is the end of the line as far as researching  this branch of the family goes,I can't see where else to go next,so thank you again, I really am most grateful.Carolyn

[islay 1]

A message for Hume - do you know how many Robert Smiths there are recorded as having died in Glasgow area between the birth of his last child and a possible old age of @90? So,so many!I have spent a fortune at SP,looking at so many records which were not the right ones,but this morning,trying again....I found it! Robert's death certificate(ship's rigger,married to Mary Byron,so no doubt) records his parents as Edward and Janet Smith(nee McLaren) - not Swan unfortunately,but puts the father's occupation down as...coachbuilder.(not baker)It seems to confirm all your hard work last month that Edward Smith was in fact Edward Swan,coachbuilder.Just thought I'd let you know that your suspicions look bang on.Thank you again foryour help last month.Best wishes,Islay.

[hume]

Hi Islay,

Such great news that Robert's death certificate came up with that information. It just shows that some information must have passed down the family, although I don't know how you'll find out why the name change occurred. Perhaps just a family rift of some sort.

Let us know if you need anything else - I'm sure there are a few missing records that would add to the story and your tree.

Regards

hume

[Wie-165]

Hi Carolyn I am Robert Swan Smith and Mary Ann Bryons great grandaughter.  He moved from Edinburgh to Greenock and started his life their with Mary.  They had their family which consisted of my grandfather and his brothers and sisters who are among names called Edward, Robert, Alexander, Mary, Jane John and James all surname Swan Smith.  Can I ask whom you are related to?