SHERMAN - a dilemma

[plimmerian]

many thanks - would be nice if there is a link between the two!

best wishes,
Ian.

[Lal]

It looks to me like the Shermans, both Thomas and Charles, were associated with St Cuthberts in Halsall, as most (but not all) the Parish records seem to turn up there. There is also a William and a Henry Sherman who had growing families at the same time, and an Elizabeth who was a single woman who had babies baptised at St Cuthberts.

I'd traced the following who may have been their children:
Mary bapt. 1829
Henry bapt. 1833
William bapt.1837
Elizabeth bapt.1846
Elizabeth bapt.1848
William bapt. 1850
Alice bapt. 1841
Thomas in my family tree seems to have lived in various villages in the area - Melling, Snape Green in Scarisbrick, Aughton and finally, Burscough.

A single woman named Alice Sherman had the following children baptised at St Cuthberts:

James - 1869
Mary 1873
Margaret 1876
Martha 1881

In 1881, Alice is living at Morris Lane with two of these children and her mother, Ellen - it seems this is the Alice Sherman who was Thomas Sherman's daughter, however.

And I have the following burials, which might be Charles and Margaret:
Burial: 20 Aug 1881 St Mark, Scarisbrick, Lancashire, England
Margaret Sherman -
    Age: 74 years
    Abode: Scarisbrick
   
Burial: 10 Dec 1881 St Mark, Scarisbrick, Lancashire, England
Charles Sherman -
    Age: 82 years
    Abode: Scarisbrick
 
A good rummage in www.lan-opc.org.uk should turn up a lot of Shermans who appear to be related to one another - there still are and always have been a lot of them around that area. I've still not managed to distinguish them all from one another but it should be possible! My feeling is that if Thomas and Charles were brothers, then their parents moved at some point from Rufford to Scarisbrick/Halsall.

[plimmerian]

my only concern is why did the Charles I'm looking at, not seem to be sure where he was born in census entries - maybe he is an "outsider" - surely he would have some idea if his "brothers" had some knowledge of the area they were born in!?!

could he even be a cousin? 

don't want to connect them by jumping the gun - it's got me in hot water before now 

best wishes,
Ian.

 

[plimmerian]

PS

interesting that a BERRY is with your 1881 household of SHERMAN...

John & Alice BENSON (nee SHERMAN) had a daughter Margaret who married Thomas PYE.

Thomas PYE had a sister Margaret who married a John Berry SMITH but they used the surname BERRY in the census / records there after! 

small world lol

 

[shermanf]

Hi, did you fing any Sherman ancestor living in Liverpool 1860s onwards or an Irish/Isle of Man connection? Thanks

[Lal]

shermanf - I've not found any of my branch of the Shermans living in Ireland/isle of Man. Some may have ended up in Liverpool as they all lived in West Lancs and folk from round there often did drift towards the city, though I've not found any yet.

It's a very common name though, also look up Sharman and Shearman as with people who could not read and write, their names are often spelled incorrectly!

[mais]

Hello lal, reading a few of your Sherman posts I realise we must have a fairly close family link. Your Alice Sherman(Sharman) b.1851 is my g.g. grandmother. I have an old tapestry which I believe was worked by her in1864 when she was 13. It reads "Death has been here and borne away A sister from our side Just in the morning As young as we she died Not long ago she did fill her placeAnd stood with us to learn But she has run her mortal race And never can return".  Unfortunately the tapestry is in very poor condtion though the text is not something I would want to display, but its lovely to have as a link to the past. I havn't figured out which of her sisters it refers to - any idea? It was found in an attic at Cut Lane,Aughton.

I also think that her daughters Mary and Martha are the 2 "old sisters" whom my dad remembers as having a shop which he used to walk to for ice cream.

[shermanf]

Thanks lal, James Sherman(Shirman) born 1859/60 has a birthplace somtimes stated as Liverpool, sometimes Ireland. He marries a Mary McaLister in Liverpool in 1880 and has four known children. John Edward, James. Mary, Elizabeth. His father on the marriage cert is named as John Sherman mariner deceased. And there it seems to stop. There is at least one other family of Shermans in Liverpool at that time but no link is apparent. It was just a long shot as to a link with your side. How far back in Lancashire can you trace your side - does it go backtothe Cornish or Essex Sherman families.

[Lal]

Thanks lal, James Sherman(Shirman) born 1859/60 has a birthplace somtimes stated as Liverpool, sometimes Ireland. He marries a Mary McaLister in Liverpool in 1880 and has four known children. John Edward, James. Mary, Elizabeth. His father on the marriage cert is named as John Sherman mariner deceased. And there it seems to stop. There is at least one other family of Shermans in Liverpool at that time but no link is apparent. It was just a long shot as to a link with your side. How far back in Lancashire can you trace your side - does it go backtothe Cornish or Essex Sherman families.

I can't get back any further than Thomas Sherman born approx 1801 in Rufford, though it's likely he had siblings/cousins ('Charles' mentioned in this thread is one likely candidate). It's possible that someone who had a mariner for a father may have been born in Ireland and moved to Liverpool (and very likely with the famine, too) - and like I say, Sherman seems to be a very common name and they aren't necessarily all related, probably because it must mean "someone who shears sheep" which was a common job. I would check on the mis-spellings because you might locate his father John. Also, you might find John Sherman's death (being a mariner, was he lost at sea?) because there could be more on the death cert.